of slow-cooked pastrami,

a whopping three quarters of a pound of them

layered onto chewy rye bread.

It's one of the most New York foods you can find,

and it's from none other than Katz's,

the city's most famous deli.

Brad Kass: That pastrami is by far the best pastrami

I've ever had in my life.

It really just melts in your mouth.

Taryn: You know the pastrami comes from Katz's

based on four factors:

the cut of meat they use, which gets extra juicy

and flavorful when it's cooked;

the monthlong curing process that gives the pastrami

its classic pink color;

the signature rub, or bark, around the edge

that's made with a blend of spices;

and the extremely skillful way

they carve it into perfectly thin slices.

Jacob Grasso: But I always get their hot pastrami.

And it's just so, like, juicy,

Liz hates the word juicy, but to describe,

it's, like, good juicy, and with the mustard

and the rye, it just ties it all together.

It's perfect.

Elizabeth Napolitano: [laughs] Yeah.

Taryn: Katz's is known for having a really long line

outside of its doors.

So I thought I'd catch up with owner Jake Dell

about how he makes some of the best pastrami in the world,

even during a shutdown.

So, can you kinda tell us a little bit

of what you guys are going through right now?

The challenges you might be facing, or?

Jake Dell: Yeah, this is definitely a challenge,

doing an interview like this.

A lot of delivery though, which is great,

and a lot of shipping nationwide.

A lot of customers getting meats by the pound,

soups for their fridge,

really just stocking up.

Taryn: One of the most popular orders

is this juicy pastrami on rye,

something that takes a month to make,

starting with the cut of meat.

While you can use a few cuts to make pastrami,

Katz's swears by the navel end.

Jake: We use navel for pastrami. That's very traditional.

And part of what makes the navel so beautiful

for this process is that the fat is really

just centralized in the middle of the cut of meat.

Whereas a brisket can kinda be on the outside,

the navel's really on the inside.

So when you're smoking it, you're pulling the fat

from the center out to the edges.

So you really get all these juices

and flavors flowing throughout, from top to bottom.

Taryn: Then comes the curing stage,

the longest part of the process,

which can last between three to four weeks.

Jake: Curing is basically just a salt bath.

It's about taking salt and breaking down

some of the muscle, some of the tissue,

some of the connective tissue.

Salt is good for preservation

and good for flavor.

Taryn: Cool. And what type of salt

do you guys use for that process?

Jake: Pink salts are a type of curing salts

that basically helps give the rose color to the meat.

Taryn: The next stage is all about intensifying flavor.

They combine a little bit of salt, pepper,

garlic, and coriander to make

the pastrami's signature rub, or bark.

Then each piece is smoked anywhere

from seven to 72 hours, depending on the size

and composition of the meat.

And how does the smoking affect the flavor

and the tenderness of the meat?

What is happening at that stage of the process?

Jake: I mean, that's,

when it comes to pastrami, that's everything, right?

Smoking and rub is so important.

What you're going to put on the outside there

is going to really soak through.

That smoking process is gonna get

these flavors to kind of meld together

and go from top to bottom, side to side, piece to piece.

And so you really get this beautiful infusion of flavor.

Taryn: The cooking process finishes off with

steaming the pastrami until it's extremely soft.

So soft that the workers behind the counter

are considered masters at slicing it.

Jake: It's very bizarre to feel the meat be that soft.

So, if we tried to put it on the slicer,

it would just crumble right through.

Forget it.

There's no chance that's gonna happen.

That's why a lot of places don't cook it this long,

because it's a huge hassle and a huge headache.

And it takes a tremendous amount of knife skills

and years of experience and practice

to really know what you're doing with that piece of meat

that can just turn into dust if you're not careful.

Brad: It kind of has that same texture as, like,

really good Texas barbecue, where you, like,

it comes off the bone and melts in your mouth.

It has that exact same concept.

Taryn: By the end of the month, Katz's pastrami

is ready to be sandwiched between

two slices of rye bread with deli mustard.

Since shutting down dine-in service,

not as many customers are lining up outside of Katz's,

but many are still ordering pickup and delivery.

Brad: When I got it a week ago it was still warm,

everything was exactly how I wanted it.

Actually, I got coleslaw on my sandwich,

and they put it on the side, which I think is a genius move,

so that it doesn't make the bread soggy, so.

It was still just as incredible

taking it home and getting it delivery.

Taryn: Fortunately, the deli isn't worried about

running out of pastrami, since Jake says

he can adjust how long he cures the meat.

Jake: Right, if business gets too slow

you can kind of increase the length of pickling.

If it goes really fast, you can decrease.

So there's a, it provides a great cushion.

Taryn: But we know the future isn't for certain,

so Jake says he's taking business day by day.

For now, the deli remains open,

as it has through recessions, depressions,

and other crises over the last 100 years.

Zach Edwards: Everyone would be a little hurt

if Katz's closed, even for the time being,

'cause it's such a New York City establishment.

It boosts the morale of everyone in New York City,

having those major landmarks stay open.

You know, it shows that New York City is strong,

New City is always strong.

Jake: If you would've asked me this five months ago

in the middle of the holiday rush,

"What do you think your Passover's gonna look like?"

This is not quite how I envisioned it.

I don't think any of us did.

So the most we can do is

to focus on the meat right in front of us.