So are you guys going to mute when I talk

史威茲畢茲：我知道了。 我說話時你們會靜音

so nothing interrupts it?

避免打斷吧？

Voice: Uhh, yes.

聲音：是的。

SB: Because once I'm in the flow, I like to stay in the flow.

史：因為當我講順了， 我會想一直順下去。

Having some type of support

當你在發揮創意時

is very necessary when you are creative.

有某種支持是很重要的。

You know, there has to be something that's fueling that creativity,

創意也是需要有助力，

that's fueling that fire that you have inside.

供應你心中那把火所需要的燃料。

My love for music and creativity starts way back, way back.

我對音樂的熱愛和創意 始於很久很久以前。

Back in the South Bronx where I grew up,

可追溯到我長大的地方，

building 700, apartment 2E.

南布朗克斯的 700 號公寓 2E。

I would go outside and all I would hear is music.

我走到室外，總是會聽到音樂。

You go around to the back park, the DJs are playing,

走到後方的公園， 會有 DJ 在播放音樂，

there's a basketball game going on,

有人正在進行籃球比賽，

but then you would look at the handball court,

但你會看向手球場，

and that handball court would have an amazing graffiti mural,

手球場的牆上有絕妙的塗鴉，

I don't know if it's from Keith Haring or Fab 5 Freddy.

我不確定那是凱斯哈林 或妙手佛迪的創作。

I was instantly attracted to the creative.

那創意馬上吸引了我。

Music has been my therapy since day one.

打從第一天起，音樂就是我的療方。

Anytime I get stressed out,

每當我焦慮不安時，

I go to the arts, I go to creativity, I go to music.

我就會轉向藝術、 轉向創意、轉向音樂。

Music makes people feel hugged, people feel loved.

音樂能讓人感到被擁抱、被愛。

And then I remember one of my uncles saying,

接著我會想起我叔叔對我說過：

"You should get into producing," I'm like, "What's producing?"

「你該投身製作。」 我說：「什麼是製作？」

You know, it started as a family-owned business,

一開始是個家族事業， 拉夫萊達斯是我家人創立的。

because Ruff Ryders was created by my family.

旗下藝人有 DMX、Eve、

It gave you DMX, it gave you Eve,

Drag-On、LOX。

it gave you Drag-On, it gave you The LOX.

在音樂方面我得到數不盡的盛讚。

I've gotten every accolade in music that one can get.

後來就到了這樣的 程度：「你知道嗎？

It just came to the point where it's like, "You know what?

我已經無法再從中找到樂趣， 除非我有辦法回報。」

I'm no longer going to have fun with this unless I'm able to give back."

Dean Collection 讓我為家人

You know, The Dean Collection started for me to create a museum for my family

以我們的名字建立一座博物館。

and our name.

我的孩子將來得要負責將它

Something that my kids would have to be responsible

一代一代傳下去。

to pass through generations.

我說：「等等，

I said, "Wait a minute,

Dean Collection 不只 是 Dean Collection 的，

The Dean Collection is not just for The Dean Collection,

Dean Collection 是大家的。」

The Dean Collection is for everyone."

現在你走進某些畫廊，某些地方，

There are some galleries now and places you walk in,

如果你沒有五萬美金， 就沒什麼可以談的。

if you don't have 50,000, there's nothing to talk about.

我覺得很多人用這個當藉口

And I felt that a lot of people were using that as an excuse

來脫離藝術。

to exit art.

他們覺得藝術是屬於有錢人的。

They feel that art is only for rich people.

哇。我們得阻止這種現象， 我們得改變它。

Whoa.

因此，我和我太太說，

We've got to stop this, we've got to fix this.

我們得為不了解 藝術世界的年輕一代

And that's what made me and my wife say,

創造一個入口，

you know, we have to create an entry point to the younger generation

不然他們都無法參與。

that didn't understand the art world,

接著，我們創辦了「不收佣金」。

didn't have their seat at the table,

它是個大活動，一個晚上 邀請函回覆多達三萬多。

and then we started "No Commissions."

飲料免費，食物免費，

It's a big event,

音樂會免費。

you got 30-something-thousand RSVPs a night.

教育免費，

The drinks are free, the food is free,

我認為教育應該要免費。

the concert's free.

我們去了上海，我們去了倫敦，

The education is free,

我們去了柏林，

and I feel that education should be free.

我們在南布朗克斯 我自家後院也辦了這個活動。

We went to Shanghai, we went to London,

你可以來「不收佣金」，

we went to Berlin,

你可以買到只要幾塊美金的東西，

we did it right in my backyard in the South Bronx.

也有幾十萬美金的東西。

You can come in to "No Commissions"

只要是熱愛藝術的人都能進來。

and get something for a couple of bucks,

我們所做的和畫廊完全不同。

or a couple hundred thousand.

銷售額 100% 屬於藝術家。

There's a tier for every person that has love for art.

但「沒有佣金」之後呢？

And what we're doing is something totally different from a gallery.

你要如何在不出賣靈魂的情況下

The artists keep 100 percent of the sales.

繼續維生、繼續走下去？

But what about after "No Commissions,"

我和我兄弟尚恩庫姆斯 參與了一個交易，

how can you sustain, how can you move forward

成交金額是兩千一百萬美金，

without having to be trapped to sell your soul?

讓凱瑞詹姆斯馬歇爾

I was a part of the sale with my brother Sean "Diddy" Combs,

成為現今還活著的非裔美國 藝術家中，出售價格最高的。

the 21-million-dollar purchase,

我說：「天，你剛打破了記錄。」

which made Kerry James Marshall

那位藝術家說：

the highest-selling African American living artist to today.

「是啊，我不知道 該開心還是傷心。」

I'm like, "Man, you just broke the record,"

他初次賣出那件作品時， 價格不到十萬美金。

and the artist was like,

想像一下，你創作了一件 不到十萬美金的作品，

"Yeah, I don't know whether to be happy or to be sad."

現在以兩千一百萬美金賣出，

He first sold that work, it was under 100,000.

而你得坐在家中看著這一切發生。

So imagine a work that you made for under 100,000

你得到的甚至不到這金額的 5%。

is now being sold for 21 million,

想想看，

and you had to sit home and watch this.

我是製作人，我是歌曲作者，

And you couldn't even participate five percent.

每當我的作品在廣播節目播出，

When you look at it,

我就會拿到錢。

I'm a producer, I'm a songwriter,

每當有電影用到我的作品，

every time it's played on the radio,

我就會拿到錢。

I get paid.

只要有播，就這樣，

Every time it's played in a movie,

我就會拿到錢。

I get paid.

視覺藝術家，他們只拿一次錢。

Every time it plays, period,

那麼，畫作被多次出售、 交易時會如何？

I get paid.

那是那位藝術家一生的心血之作，

Visual artists, they only get paid once.

其他人靠它賺的錢 卻比創作它的藝術家

How, when paintings are sold and traded multiple times?

多出十倍、十五倍， 有時甚至一百倍。

And that's that artist's lifetime work,

所以我創辦了「迪恩的選擇」，

that other people are making 10, 15,

如果你是賣家

sometimes 100 times more than the artist that created it.

或收藏家，

So I created something called the Dean's Choice,

你把你手上的作品帶到 比如蘇富比（拍賣行），

where if you're a seller,

那裡有張紙寫著： 「嘿，各位，要知道，

or a collector,

這位藝術家還活著。

and you bring in your work into, let's say, Sotheby's,

你和這位藝術家合作，

there's a paper that's there that says, "Hey, guys, you know,

讓你的投資賺了 300%。

this artist is still living.

這個交易，你可以選擇 要給這位藝術家多少。」

You've made 300 percent on your investment

我想，就算有五個人這麼做，

by working with this artist.

也會開始改變藝術圈的一切。

You can choose to give the artist whatever you want of the sale."

在歐洲已經發生了。

I think that even if five people did it,

在音樂產業也發生了，

it'll start to change everything in the arts.

叫做出版。

And this is happening in Europe already.

藝術家能夠生存下去，

It happens in the music industry,

音樂家能夠生存下去，

it's called publishing.

年復一年，因為他們能 得到出版的剩餘收益。

And artists are able to survive,

我們要如何將創意集結在一起，

musicians are able to survive,

並頌揚彼此？

years after years,

我自己和提姆巴蘭就想了個辦法，

off of the residual income of their publishing.

叫做 Verzuz， 到現在已經有三年了。

So how can we take something that brings creatives together,

嘗試的時機到了，

and celebrate each other?

大家都開始使用 社群媒體來表達自我。

Myself and Timbaland have been working on this idea

我們的做法是，

called Verzuz for about three years now.

我播放我的名曲，

Then this trying time came,

他播放他的名曲，

and everybody started going to social media

我們到 IG 上直播。

to express themselves.

（影片）（笑聲）

So what we did was I played my top songs,

提姆巴蘭：你們開心嗎？ 這對文化非常好。

he played his top songs,

史：很多人說是「對戰」，

and we went on Instagram Live.

我們不用這個詞， 因為現今世界上已經太多對戰了。

(Video) (Laughter)

我們把它叫做教育盛典。

Timbaland: You having fun?

我想現在已經是第九或第十屆了。

This is so good for the culture.

我和提姆巴蘭一開始時 只有兩萬人參與。

SB: A lot of people like to say "battle,"

截至昨天為止，

we pulled back off of that word "battle,"

有七十五萬人齊聚一堂。

because we're battling enough in the world today.

所以我們有所謂的「Verzuz 效應」。

We call it educational celebration.

當藝術家對 Verzuz 做出貢獻之後

I think we're on our ninth or tenth one.

他們就會發生「Verzuz 效應」。

Me and Timbaland started out with 20,000 people.

比如娃娃臉和泰迪萊利。

As of yesterday, 750,000 people in one room.

他們的點閱率都衝到了數百萬。

So, we have this thing called the "Verzuz Effect."

他們的歌曲都重新進入排行榜。

And the "Verzuz Effect" is what happens to the artist

接著，我們可以看看 最早參與 Verzuz 的女性，

after they contribute to Verzuz.

艾莉卡芭朵和吉兒史考特

We can go to the Babyface and Teddy Riley.

包辦了排行榜前二十名當中的七名。

They both went up millions of views.

這就是 Verzuz 效應。

Both of their songs reentered the charts.

數十億數十億數十億的印象。

And then we look at the first ladies Verzuz,

那是我以前從來沒有見過的。

and both Erykah Badu and Jill Scott

我覺得，

have seven positions in the top 20 charts.

這些藝術家今天能聞到花朵的香味

This is the Verzuz Effect.

是很棒的事。

You know, billions and billions and billions of impressions.

這對我有很個人的意義，因為，

This is something I've never seen before.

我經常被排除，

And I felt that these artists are getting their flowers today,

我起起落落了一百次。

which is a great thing, while they can smell them.

你得要了解身為藝術家這個事業，

This was personal for me,

要提升到你應得的層級。

because many a times I've been counted out,

因為我們大部分的 創作者都很情緒化，

I've been hot and cold 100 times.

我們非常會「那個讓別人 去做，我要堅持這個。」

You still have to understand the business as an artist,

但關鍵不只有創意， 教育也是關鍵，

to elevate to your level that you deserve to be.

這就是為什麼我在三十五歲左右

Because most creatives, we're very emotional,

還回到學校讀書的原因。

we're very "let somebody else handle that, I want to stick to this."

我們必須要了解我們的事業。

But not only creativity is key, education is key,

但那會需要我們更深入一些，

which is the reason why I went back to school

這個世界在等著佔創意的便宜，

to sharpen my pencil in my mid-30s.

我們得要把必要的知識 搬出來讓自己做好準備。

We have to know our business.

這樣我們才能做更好的選擇，

But it's going to take us digging in a little deeper

接著才能終止藝術家 到死都很窮的情況。

and pulling out the knowledge that we need to prepare ourselves

如果我們不保護藝術， 就無法護我們的未來，

for this world that's waiting to take advantage of the creatives.

就無法保護這個世界。

Then we can make better choices,

創意能療癒我們。

then we can end that conversation of artists dying poor.

為什麼要拉上這些窗簾？

If we're not protecting the arts,

暫停。

we're not protecting our future,

（嗤笑）

we're not protecting this world.

聲音：我蠻喜歡那樣的。挺酷的。

Creativity heals us.

史威茲畢茲：（笑）

What's these shades closing for?

Time out.

(Scoffs)

Voice: I kind of like that. That was cool.

SB: (Laughs)