KQED新聞室。婦女與技術 (KQED NEWSROOM: Women and Tech) - VoiceTube: Learn English through videos!

Subtitles section Play video

>>> GOOD EVENING.
WELCOME TO KQED "NEWSROOM."
I'M THUY VU.
TECH COMPANIES ARE UNDER
INCREASING PRESSURE TO SHOW
PROGRESS.
APPLE, INTEL AND OTHER FIRMS
WILL BE MEETING TO PRESS THEM TO
DIVERSE THEIR WORKFORCES.
WE'RE GOING TO LOOK AT ONE
ASPECT OF THIS PROBLEM, THE
GENDER GAP.
YAHOO!'S MARISA AND FACEBOOK'S
SHERYL SANDBERG ARE THE
EXCEPTION, NOT THE RULE IN
SILICON VALLEY.
WOMEN ARE UNDERREPRESENTED.
AT YAHOO! WOMEN MAKE UP 37% OF
THE WORKFORCE.
AT FACEBOOK, 32% OF THE
EMPLOYEES ARE FEMALE.
AT GOOGLE, 30% ARE WOMEN.
MOST SOFTWARE ENGINEERS ARE MEN
AND SO ARE MOST OF THE
EXECUTIVES.
LIKE TO WORK IN THAT
MALE-DOMINATED WORLD.
>> I'M A SOLUTION ENGINEER.
>> MY NAME IS EMA.
I'M A SOFTWARE ENGINEER.
>> MY NAME IS ZOE AND I'M A
SOFTWARE ENGINEER.
>> MY NAME IS ZOE AND I'M A
WEB FRAMEWORK CALLED RAILS.
YOU MIGHT HEAR THE TERM RUBY ON
RAILS.
>> I LEARNED PYTHON RECENTLY AND
EVEN DAB BELLED WITH A VERY OLD,
LOW LEVEL LANGUAGE.
AND THE SERVICES I CAN PROVIDE
RANGE FROM CONSULTING AND
ADVISING AROUND HOW TO USE
TECHNOLOGY TO BUILD SOLUTIONS
ALL THE WAY DOWN TO ACTUALLY
BUILDING OUT YOUR FIRST
PROTOTYPE.
BUILT
CLASSES IN COLLEGE BUT THE
EXPERIENCE IS ALIENATING.
THE COURSES WERE 90% MALE.
I LOOKED AROUND AT ME AND THE
PEOPLE WHO ALREADY NEW
PROGRAMMING AND THEY WERE SO FAR
ADVANCED I DIDN'T THINK I COULD
CATCH UP.
IS INSANE BECAUSE I ACTUALLY
LIKE TO PROGRAM.
IT'S JUST THE WAY THE SYSTEM WAS
SET UP.
>> I GOT INTO TECHNOLOGY BECAUSE
MY MOM MADE ME.
[ LAUGHTER ]
MY MOM IS JUST REALLY VERY
SMART, WONDERFUL INCREDIBLE
WOMAN.
IE
SHE RAISED EIGHT KIDS ON HER OWN
AND SHE COULD SEE -- SHE WAS
VERY FORWARD THINKING AND COULD
SEE THAT TECHNOLOGY WAS GOING TO
RUN THE WORLD.
AND SHE GAVE ME A SOFTWARE BOOK,
A PROGRAMMING BOOK, SHE SAID
YOU'RE GOING TO DO THIS EVERY
DAY UNTIL YOU FIGURE IT OUT.
>> THE FIRST PERSON WHO ASKED ME
IF I WANTED TO BE A SOFTWARE
ENGINEER WAS A WOMAN AT AN EVENT
AND SHE IS LIKE, DO YOU WANT TO
BE A SOFTWARE ENGINEER, ARE YOU
THINKING ABOUT IT?
I'M LIKE YEAH.
AND I VERY BEGRUDGINGLY ADMITTED
IT AND SHE'S LIKE, YES!
>> WOMEN ARE HALF THE POPULATION
OF THE WORLD AND WE NEED TO MAKE
SURE THAT THEY HAVE THEIR PART
IN CREATING THE TECHNOLOGY THAT
IS GOING TO MAKE THE WORLD
BETTER FOR EVERYONE, INCLUDING
WOMEN.
G
AT LEAST 5 TO 10% OF YOUR TIME,
IF YOU'RE A WOMAN, IS BEING A
WOMAN.
AND IT'S BECAUSE YOU HAVE TO
FIGURE OUT HOW TO VIEW WOMEN IN
A MALE-DOMINATED ENVIRONMENT.
>> NOW, IN HINDSIGHT, I
DEFINITELY REALIZE THERE WERE
LOTS OF OBSTACLES.
THERE WERE LOTS OF INCIDENTS
THAT I JUST CHOSE TO IGNORE.
I HAD TO WORK MUCH HARDER TO GET
NOTICED FOR MY WORK.
I HAVE TO WORK HARDER TO FIGURE
OUT HOW TO INTERRUPT PEOPLE BUT
BE REALLY POLITE ABOUT IT.
>> I'M ALWAYS KEENLY OBSERVING
WHEN I SAY, I'M ACTUALLY A
SOFTWARE ENGINEER AND YOU CAN
SEE THEM FOR A SECOND AND THEN
YOU'RE LIKE, OH, THAT'S COOL.
IT'S ALWAYS LIKE A POSITIVE
REACTION BUT THERE'S A MOMENT OF
SURPRISE.
>> WOMEN ARE MORE THAN MEN AND
IF YOU BRING IT UP, IT'S
SOMETHING THAT NOBODY HAS
NOTICED BEFORE AND IT'S A WEIRD
CONVERSATION TO HAVE.
NO>> THERE ARE OTHER DIVERSITYD
ISSUES THAT MIGHT BE EVEN MORE,
YOU KNOW, PROBLEMATIC, LIKE
WHERE ARE ALL OF THE OLD PEOPLE
GO.
WH>> THE SECRET IN HIRING MOREE
WOMEN IS KEEPING THE ONES THAT
YOU HAVE.
A LOT OF WOMEN WANT TO WORK WITH
OTHER SOFTWARE ENGINEERS.
NOBODY WANTS TO BE THE FIRST
ENGINEER OUT OF 20 WHO IS A
WOMAN.
OA
I WANT TO ASK OUR PANEL NOWHT.
ABOUT WHAT THEY JUST HEARD.
JOINING ME ARE RUPERT, FOUNDER
OF CODECHICKS.ORG, A NONPROFIT
DEDICATED TO INCREASING THE
NUMBER OF WOMEN ENGINEERS,
SOPHIE LEE, A RIDE SHARING
PROGRAM FOR WOMEN AND CHILDREN
AND AN ASSOCIATE VENTURE
PARTNERS.
WELCOME TO YOU ALL.
WE HEARD ABOUT RETENTION, WE
HEARD ABOUT TRYING TO FIGURE OUT
HOW TO BE A WOMAN IN A
MALE-DOMINATED WORLD.
DID ANY OF THOSE MESSAGES
RESONATE WITH YOU?
LUPA?
RE>> ABSOLUTELY.U?
ALL OF THEM RESONATED.
ONE OF THE THINGS THAT I'M
TRYING TO DO WITH CODE CHICK IS
ADDRESS THE RETENTION PROBLEM.
ACCORDING TO STATICS, AS OF
2013, THERE'S A 56 PERCENT DROP
FROM INJURIES AND LATELY THERE'S
A LOT OF FOCUS ON THE PIPELINE
ISSUE AS IN GETTING MORE WOMEN
TO COME INTO THE INDUSTRY.
BUT NOT AS MUCH FOCUS ON THE
WOMEN THAT ARE ALREADY IN THERE
AND THAT ARE LEAVING AND THE
REASONS FOR THEIR LEAVING.
SO THIS IS A VERY, VERY
IMPORTANT TOPIC, AS YOU JUST
SAW.
>> AND SOPHIE, YOU'RE HEAD OF
THE ENGINEERING AT SHUTTLE.
WHAT PART OF THAT VIDEO
RESONATED WITH YOU AND HOW DO
YOU RETAIN WOMEN?
>> I MEAN, THE PART OF THE VIDEO
THAT RESONATED WITH ME MOST WAS
THAT THERE WAS EVEN A VIDEO.
I FEEL LIKE THREE OF US ARE
SITTING THERE AND WE SAW THREE
AWESOME WOMEN TALKING ABOUT
THEIR EXPERIENCES.
MET
THIS REALLY EXCITING TURNING
POINT WHERE WOMEN ARE GETTING
RECOGNIZED AND ARE STARTING TO
ENTER THE ENGINEERING FIELD.
AND I'M NOT SURE HOW TO RETAIN
WOMEN.
AND I'M NOT SURE HOW TO RETAIN
ABOUT HOW DO YOU RETAIN PEOPLE.
WOMEN ARE PEOPLE JUST LIKE
EVERYONE ELSE.
I THINK IF YOU'RE ABLE TO CREATE
A TEAM ENVIRONMENT WHERE
EVERYBODY IS RECOGNIZED AND
GIVING A CHANCE TO LISTENED TO,
YOU'RE GOING TO BE ABLE TO KEEP
THE WOMEN.
>> CECILIA, DID YOU FEEL
FAMILIARITY THERE?
>> YES.
IT WAS PROBABLY 20 TO 30
FOUNDERS AND WEEK THAT WE MET
WITH AND I HATE TO SAY A SMALL
NUMBER OF THOSE PEOPLE ARE
USUALLY WOMEN.
SOMETIMES THEY WILL GO ALL WEEK
AND NOT SEE A FEMALE FOUNDER AT
ALL.
PART OF THAT IS THAT FREQUENTLY
FOUNDERS ARE TECHNICAL AND THERE
ARE LESS WOMEN IN ENGINEERING.
IT'S A PROBLEM THAT WE NEED TO
SOLVE.
>> SO HOW DO YOU SOLVE THAT IN
WHEN YOU'RE CONSIDERING
INVESTING IN A COMPANY, HOW
IMPORTANT IS DIVERSITY TO YOU?
DO YOU ASK THEM, ARE THERE WOMEN
ON YOUR LEADERSHIP TEAM?
>> IT'S SOMETHING FREQUENTLY NOT
ASKED BUT THERE WILL BE A SLIDE
THAT SAYS, HERE'S OUR TEAM AND
WHEN I SEE A TEAM THAT'S ONLY
MALE EXECUTIVES, ESPECIALLY ONLY
WHITE MALE EXECUTIVES, I WILL
MAKE A MENTAL NOTE AND SAY, WOW,
THIS TEAM IS NOT THINKING ABOUT
DIVERSITY IN THE SAME WAY.
I KNOW THAT THERE'S A PIPELINE
PROBLEM AND I KNOW THAT IS ALSO
NOT AN EXCUSE BUT SOMETHING WE
FACTOR IN.
>> SO, THEN, HOW DO YOU ADDRESS
THAT BECAUSE IF YOU SEE A SLIDE
AND IT'S ALL MALES.
>> YEAH.
>> DO YOU SAY TO THEM, YOU NEED
TO HAVE A FEMALE EXECUTIVES OR
HAVE YOU INTERVIEWED ANY FEMALES
FOR THIS JOB?
>> WE WILL NOT PUT THEM ON A
SPOT IN A PITCH MEETING BUT IT'S
A RELATIONSHIP THAT'S GOING TO
EXIST FOR AT LEAST THREE YEARS,
PROBABLY CLOSER TO SEVEN OR TEN.
SO AS YOU SPEND TIME WITH THEM,
YOU HAVE DINNERS AND THEN YOU
KIND OF ADDRESS DIVERSITY ISSUES
AND TALK ABOUT, WHAT ARE YOU
LOOKING TO BUILD IN A TEAM?
WHAT ARE YOUR PRIORITIES IN YOUR
CULTURE?
CULTURE PILLARS THAT MAKE UP A
COMPANY AND SAY THIS IS A PLACE
WHERE ALL PEOPLE ARE GOING TO BE
WELCOME OR THIS TEAM FEELS VERY
CLOSED AND MIGHT SUFFER AS A
RESULT.
>> SOPHIE, WOMEN MAKE UP HALF OF
YOUR ENGINEERING TEAM AT
SHUTTLE, WHICH IS PRETTY
ASTOUNDING BECAUSE MOST
HIGH-TECH COMPANIES HELP AROUND
70/30, RIGHT?
70 MALE AND 30% FEMALE.
TELL US --
>> MAYBE.
TELL US --
>> USUALLY WELL BELOW 20%.
>> OKAY.
>> WELL, TELL US ABOUT YOUR
HIRING PROCESS.
AND HOW DID YOU GET IT TO 50%?
>> I THINK TO -- TO REACH THE
DIVERSITY THAT WE WERE ABLE TO
HAVE AT SHUTTLE, THE THING ABOUT
DIVERSITY IS WHEN YOU SEE IT AS
A BENCHMARK THAT HIT, THAT'S NOT
GOING TO DO IT.
I THINK THE IMPORTANT THING TO
SEE DIVERSITY, TO UNDERSTAND WHY
IT'S SO IMPORTANT, RIGHT, IF YOU
HAVE A ROOM FULL OF PEOPLE THAT
EVERYBODY IS THE SAME, EVERYBODY
IS A WHITE MALE, YOU'RE GOING TO
END UP WITH A VERY
ONE-DIMENSIONAL PRODUCT IN A
VERY ONE-DIMENSIONAL COMPANY.
STARTING OUT WITH THE WHY AND
UNDERSTANDING WHY IT'S IMPORTANT
WAS THE FIRST IMPORTANT THING
WITHOUT HIRING A STRATEGY AT
SHUTTLE.
WITHOUT HIRING A STRATEGY AT
TO HIRE PEOPLE THAT YOU'RE
FRIENDS WITH.
YOU WANT TO WORK WITH PEOPLE
JUST LIKE YOU.
BUT LIKE -- THAT'S NOT GOING TO
WORK BECAUSE THE WORLD ISN'T
FULL OF PEOPLE WHO ARE JUST LIKE
YOU.
FULL SO TAKING IT FROM THAT LIKE
PERSPECTIVE, YOU KNOW, IT'S
ABOUT BEING UNCOMFORTABLE AND
TRYING TO MEET PEOPLE, GO TO
EVENTS, FIND NEW CIRCLES OF
PEOPLE WHO JUST NOT LIKE YOU.
I THINK GETTING UNCOMFORTABLE
WAS THE SECOND STEP.
>> THAT'S VERY INTERESTING.
CECELIA ALLUDED TO THIS EARLIER,
THE PIPELINE PROBLEM.
WE KEEP ON HEARING ABOUT THAT.
WE NEED MORE WOMEN AND GIRLS,
FOR EXAMPLE.
BUT HOW MUCH OF THE GENDER GAP
IS ACTUALLY A PIPELINE PROBLEM
AND HOW MUCH OF IT IS MORE OF A
PROBLEM WITH A WORKPLACE CULTURE
THAT IS PERHAPS NOT FRIENDLY TO
WOMEN?
O
SEPARATE ISSUES.
THE PIPELINE PROBLEM IS MORE THE
GIRLS IN MIDDLE SCHOOL, HIGH
SCHOOL, COLLEGE, GRADUATION
RATES AND ALSO GRADUATION WITHIN
THE STEM AREAS.
SO THAT'S ONE ISSUE THAT IS A
PROBLEM.
SO THAT'S ONE ISSUE THAT IS A
A FEDERAL LEVEL WITH A LOT OF
FEDERAL FUNDING TOWARDS THOSE
INITIATIVES.
LE
PROBLEM FOR WORKPLACE CULTURE
AND WHY TALENTED WOMEN, WHO HAVE
BEEN IN THE INDUSTRY FOR MANY
YEARS, ARE LEAVING THE INDUSTRY.
AND SOME OF THOSE ISSUES ARE
RELATED TO ADVANCEMENT,
PROMOTIONS, THE TYPE OF WORK
THAT THEY DO USUALLY YOU WILL
HEAR THINGS LIKE, OH, YOU KNOW,
WOMEN NEED EXTRA BALANCE BECAUSE
OF FAMILIES, ET CETERA, THAT HAS
NOT ACTUALLY BEEN THE KEY POINT
FOR WOMEN LEAVING.
IT'S -- THERE WAS A STUDY ON
THIS AND THEY CAME UP WITH
ALMOST 70% OF WOMEN LEAVE
BECAUSE THEY SAY THEY ARE NOT
GETTING PROMOTED, THEY ARE NOT
GETTING GOOD PROJECTS TO DO THE
GOOD WORK, TO SHOW CASE
THEMSELVES AND GET AHEAD IN
THEIR CAREERS.
THAT ITSELF IS ONE OF THE
ISSUES.
SO WE'RE TRYING TO ADDRESS THE
SKILL PROBLEM.
WHEN SOMEBODY IS IN AN INDUSTRY
AND WORKING FULL TIME, YOU'RE
VERY FOCUSED ON WHATEVER IT IS
YOU'RE WORKING ON.
YOU'RE DEVELOPING SKILLS JUST IN
THAT.
INDUSTRY IS GOING UP LIKE AT
BREAK NECK SPEED WITH NEW
TECHNOLOGY AND TOOLS COMING OUT.
TO KEEP UP WITH THAT IS
EXTREMELY DIFFICULT.
ESPECIALLY FOR WOMEN WHO HAVE
FAMILIES THEY HAVE TO TAKE CARE
OF, FULL-TIME JOB, YOU KNOW,
JUST NOT ENOUGH HOURS IN THE DAY
TO DO THAT.
WHAT ABOUT THE GREATER WORKPLACE
CULTURE ISSUE THAT YOU TALKED
ABOUT?
CULTURE ISSUE THAT YOU TALKED
CECILA?
>> I THINK IT'S DOABLE.
I DON'T THINK CULTURES ARE SET
IN STONE.
THEY ARE MADE UP OF PEOPLE.
WE CREATE A CULTURE WHEN WE SIT
IN THIS ROOM TOGETHER.
IT'S SOMETHING THAT I THINK
SOPHIE POINTED OUT REALLY WELL,
ADDRESSING THE WHY AT FIRST AND
THEN ADDRESSING GETTING
UNCOMFORTABLE AND TALKING ABOUT
IT AS A COMPANY.
ONE OF OUR INVESTMENTS IN
PINTREST, THEY'VE DONE A TON ON
IMPROVING DIVERSITY.
THEY ARE DOING TRAINING SO THEIR
MANAGER IS UNHEARD OF IT.
THEY ARE TAKING THE MANAGERS AND
SAYING, OKAY, TAKE A TEST.
NOW, LET'S SEE THAT YOU HAVE
BIASES AGAINST THESE KINDS OF
PEOPLE.
SO WHEN YOU'RE INTERVIEWING
THEM, BE AWARE OF THAT.
WATCH OUT THAT YOU INTERRUPT
THEM TOO EARLY, WATCH OUT THAT
YOU'RE NOT SORT OF SEEING THEM
THROUGH AND ARE POSITIONING
YOURSELF AGAINST THEM EVEN
THOUGH THEY MIGHT BE JUST AS
QUALITIED AS SOMEONE ELSE THAT
IS MORE SIMILAR TO YOU.
>> SPEAKING OF PINTREST.
THIS RELEASED THEIR DIVERSITY
GOALS THIS WEEK AND THEY
DISCUSSED THE NFL ALREADY DOES
THIS, WHERE YOU INTERVIEW AT
LEAST ONE PERSON FROM AN
UNDERREPRESENTED GROUP OR ONE
FEMALE.
>> UH-HUH.
>> FOR A LEADERSHIP POSITION.
IS THAT SOMETHING THAT YOU THINK
SHOULD BE HAPPENING AT ALL TECH
COMPANIES?
H
DID.
HAVE.
WHAT'S HARD IS -- AND WE DO
THIS.
'SO
MEMBER FOR A COMPANY.
THERE ARE PEOPLE WHO SAY THAT
THAT IS A BAD WAY TO APPROACH
THE PROBLEM.
GO FIND THE PEOPLE WHO ARE THE
MOST QUALIFIED AND GET THEM IN
THE ROOM AND HIRE THE BEST ONES.
TRYING TO SORT OF HIRE FOUR A
SPECIFIC DEMOGRAPHIC DOESN'T
MAKE SENSE.
SPECIFIC DEMOGRAPHIC DOESN'T
TO DO, PERSONALLY.
WHAT DO YOU GUYS THINK?
>> I THINK IT'S GOING TO BE
REALLY, REALLY HARD TO FIND, YOU
KNOW, A FEMALE REPRESENTATIVE
FOR WHATEVER X, Y, Z POSITION
YOU'RE TRYING TO FILL BECAUSE
THERE JUST AREN'T THAT MANY.
ESPECIALLY --
WOMEN.
>> I WOULD TOTALLY DISAGREE.
THE REASON THERE'S A PERCEPTION
THERE'S NOT THAT MANY FEMALE
ENGINEERS IS THAT WE'RE
ACTUALLY -- OUR SOCIAL CIRCLES
TEND TO STAY KIND OF STATIC.
WE LOOK AT OUR SOCIAL CIRCLES
AND SAY, OUT OF THE 200 PEOPLE I
REGULARLY INTERACT WITH, THIS
MANY ARE FEMALE ENGINEERS.
THERE ARE 7 BILLION PEOPLE IN
THE WORLD.
CONCRETE, I JUST WENT TO A
CONFERENCE EARLIER IN THE YEAR
WHICH IS AN EVEN MORE
FINALLY-GRAINED SEGMENT OF WOMEN
IN TECH.
WE FILLED THE ENTIRE THEATER.
THERE WERE 3,000 OF US.
YOU LOOK AROUND AND YOU REALIZE,
THERE ARE TOTALLY WOMEN IN TECH.
I'M JUST NOT LOOKING AT THE
RIGHT PLACES.
THAT WAS A WAKE-UP CALL FOR ME.
>> I WANT TO ASK YOU THIS
QUESTION ABOUT START-UPS.
MANY SAY SURVIVAL IS AN
ABSOLUTE --
>> YEAH.
>> AND NOT SO MUCH DIVERSITY.
JUST TRYING TO FIGHT TO SAVE
THEIR COMPANIES.
WHAT DO YOU SAY TO THEM?
>> DEPENDS ON WHAT STAGE.
AND IF YOU ARE A THREE-PERSON
STARTUP, DIVERSITY IS GREAT BUT
WHEN YOU'RE ADDING A FOURTH,
THERE'S ONLY SO MUCH THAT YOU
CAN DO.
YOU'RE TRYING TO HIRE
DESPERATELY.
YOU'RE TRYING TO HIRE
CHOOSE.
PLEASE GET TO JOIN ME?
WHO IS GOING TO BE GOOD ENOUGH
TO BUILD THIS COMPANY WITH US?
IF YOU'RE REALLY EARLY STAGE, IT
DEPENDS ON THE NETWORK.
I THINK GENERALIZING THAT THERE
ARE WOMEN IN TECH THAT ARE
GREAT, IT'S A LOT OF WHO YOU
KNOW.
GU
ARE MALE.
I HAVE A COUPLE FEMALE ENGINEERS
AND IF I'M INTENTIONAL OF
BUILDING MY NETWORK WITH WOMEN,
IT WILL BE SO EVEN MORE.
IT HAS TO DO WITH SURVIVAL AT
THE EARLY PART.
I HOPE YOU HAVE SOMEONE TALKING
ABOUT IT WHO CARES.
I THINK THE FIRST STEP IS REALLY
THE EMPATHY AND UNDERSTANDING
THAT THIS IS A REAL PROBLEM ON
OUR HANDS, THAT WE NEED TO SOLVE
TO MAKE OUR COMPANY BETTER.
SO THE THING ABOUT CULTURE IS
IMPORTANT THERE.
>> GIVING IT A THOUGHT IS ONE
THING.
E
CHANGE WILL HAPPEN?
COMPANIES HAVE BEEN PROMISING
FOR YEARS THAT THEY WILL
DIVERSIFY THEIR WORKFORCE.
THE NUMBERS HAVEN'T REALLY
MOVED.
HP HAS BEEN RELEASING ITS
NUMBERS FOR MORE THAN A DECADE.
30% OF ITS WORKFORCE WERE WOMEN.
TEN YEARS LATER IT WAS 32%.
THE NEEDLE DIDN'T MOVE MUCH.
DO YOU THINK THAT REAL CHANGE
WILL INDEED COME THIS TIME?
>> I'M OPTIMISTIC.
>> ME, TOO.
>> AND LET ME TELL YOU WHY,
PLEASE.
,
CONVERSATION IS HAPPENING MAKES
ME SO EXCITED.
AND IT'S MAKING ME REALIZE THAT
IF WE WANT THAT CHANGE TO
HAPPEN, IT'S GOING TO BE UP TO
EACH OF THE THREE OF US ON A
PANEL RIGHT NOW.
TO EXTEND THE CONVERSATION
BEYOND THIS INTERVIEW, TO TALK
TO THE PEOPLE THAT WE'RE ABLE TO
TALK TO BECAUSE OF THE POSITIONS
WE ARE IN.
IN THAT SENSE, IF IT'S IN OUR
POWER, I THINK THESE WOMEN ARE
INCREDIBLE AND I'M OPTIMISTIC
FOR THE FUTURE.
C
>> I'M CAUTIOUSLY OPTIMISTIC, I
WOULD SAY.
THERE IS SOMETHING -- THERE IS
DIFFERENT PIECES, LIKE I WAS
TALKING ABOUT THE GIRLS AND
WOMEN IN COLLEGE, THE
EXPECTATIONS THAT THEY ARE GIVEN
REGARDING THE INDUSTRY MAY NOT
BE AS ACCURATE AS THEY SHOULD
BE, IN MY OPINION.
THERE IS A CERTAIN DEGREE OF
WHAT I CALL BACKGROUND RADIATION
THAT EXISTS IN PARTICULARLY
ENGINEERING.
S Y
>> WHAT DO YOU MEAN BY THAT?
>> ADVANCEMENT ISSUES, THESE ARE
ALL -- YOU JUST DEAL WITH IT
WHEN YOU'RE COMING INTO THE
INDUSTRY AND USUALLY WHEN YOU'RE
IN COLLEGE YOU'RE NOT TOLD ABOUT
THESE THINGS.
IN COLLEGE YOU'RE NOT TOLD ABOUT
THIS.
IBUT YOU COME INTO THE INDUSTRYT
AND LEARN, WAIT, ALL OF THIS
GOES ON WHICH I NEVER LEARNED
ABOUT.
AND YOU JUST -- SOME OF IT --
EVERYBODY HAS TO DEAL WITH IT,
WHETHER YOU'RE FEMALE OR MALE,
AND I THINK JUST UNDERSTANDING
THAT AND BEING ABLE TO COPE WITH
IT AND TO REALLY FOCUS ON THE
GOOD THINGS AND HOW TECHNOLOGY
CAN REALLY HELP ADVANCE YOUR
CAREER, MAKE YOU FINANCIALLY
STABLE AND JUST, YOU KNOW, YOU
CAN BUILD REALLY COOL THINGS
THAT YOU CAN'T DO IN MOST OTHER
FIELDS.
R
SO I AM CERTAINLY CAUTIOUSLY
OPTIMISTIC ABOUT IT.
YEAH.
OPTIMISTIC ABOUT IT.
THAT CAUTIOUSLY OPTIMISTIC NOTE.
THANK YOU ALL.
PLEASURE TO HAVE YOU ALL.
>> THANK YOU.
>> THANKS.
>>> OUR UBER DRIVERS EMPLOYEES
OR INDEPENDENT CONTRACTORS?
THAT QUESTION IS CURRENTLY
BEFORE A FEDERAL COURT.
A SMALL GROUP OF FORMER DRIVERS
HAVE SUED UBER SAYING THEY
SHOULD HAVE BEEN CLASSIFIED AS
EMPLOYEES.
NEXT WEEK, THE COURT WILL HEAR
ARGUMENTS ON WHETHER THE SUIT
CAN BE EXPANDED TO INCLUDE MANY
IF NOT ALL OF THE 160,000 U.S.
DRIVERS.
THE CASE COULD HAVE A BIG IMPACT
ON THE SO-CALLED SHARING
ECONOMY.
OUR COLLEAGUE SPOKE TO A
PROFESSOR OF MANAGEMENT SCIENCE
AT NEW YORK UNIVERSITY.
>> HOW DO THESE COMPANIES DEFINE
THEMSELVES MATTERS CERTAINLY IN
THE COURT OF LAW AND ALSO IN THE
COURT OF PUBLIC OPINION.
ARE THESE PLATFORMS?
ARE THEY DELIVERY COMPANIES?
ARE THEY COMPANIES WITH
EMPLOYEES?
EY CH
FREELANCERS?
SORT OF LIKE THE MARKET AND
HIERARCHY, SO TO SPEAK.
AND DIGITAL TECHNOLOGY HAS
DEFINED NEW INSTITUTION AND
ORGANIZATIONAL FORMS.
WE JUST NEED TO RECOGNIZE THAT
THIS IS A NEW FORM OF ORGANIZING
ECONOMIC ACTIVITY THAT HAS SOME
OF THE CHARACTERISTICS OF A
HANDS-OFF MARKET AND OF A
CORPORATION.
>> SO IS UBER A CAR SERVICE OR
TECH COMPANY?
>> SO IS UBER A CAR SERVICE OR
RIGHT?
>> SO IS UBER A CAR SERVICE OR
BUT TO SAY THAT IT'S PURELY A
MATCHING PLATFORM SEEMS TO SORT
OF BE A LITTLE DISCONNECTED FROM
REALITY.
IT'S A $50 BILLION COST SERVICE
ALSO SEEMS DISCONNECTED FROM THE
REALITY AND THE FACT THAT IT IS
AT ITS CORE A PLATFORM THAT
MATCHES INDEPENDENT DRIVERS WITH
PEOPLE SORT OF DOING IT WITH A
LOT OF LAYERS THAT TRADITIONALLY
INAUDIBLE ].
THE UBER CASE IS "WALL STREET
JOURNAL" TECHNOLOGY REPORTER
DOUGLAS McMILLAN.
DOUG, WELCOME BACK.
>> THANKS FOR HAVING ME.
>> YOU BROKE SOME NEWS TODAY
REGARDING UBER.
IT IS NOW VALUED AT NEARLY $51
BILLION.
1
>> IT'S A VERY BIG NUMBER.
IT'S ONLY ONE OF TWO
VENTURE-BACKED PRIVATE TECH
E OF O
VALUATION.
FACEBOOK.
UBER HAS DONE HERE IS IT GOT TO
THAT VALUATION FASTER THAN
FACEBOOK.
THN
SEVEN YEARS.
UBER IS NOW FIVE YEARS OLD AND
IT'S PRETTY ASTOUNDING FEAT FOR
THIS COMPANY THAT WASN'T AROUND
FIVE YEARS AGO.
>> IT IS EXTRAORDINARY.
SO IN THE CASE THAT WE JUST
TALKED ABOUT, SHOULD THE DRIVERS
BE CONTRACTORS OR EMPLOYEES, IS
THIS COMPANY, UBER, NOW VALUED
AT NEARLY $51 BILLION, ARGUING
THAT IT CAN'T AFFORD TO CLASSIFY
ITS CONTRACTORS, ITS DRIVERS AS
EMPLOYEES?
S
THAT THIS IS ONE OF MANY
COMPANIES IN THIS KIND OF
SHARING ECONOMY THAT IS
EMPLOYING THESE CONTRACTORS THAT
THESE QUESTIONS ARE AROUND.
BUT UBER IS THE MOST MATURE
COMPANY.
THEY HAVE OVER 200,000 DRIVERS
AND THEY HAVE THE MOST AT STAKE
IN THIS BATTLE.
IF UBER WERE FORCED TO
RECLASSIFY ALL OF THESE DRIVERS
WHO ARE NOW CONTRACTORS TO
BECOME EMPLOYEES, THAT WOULD ADD
HUGE COSTS FOR THIS COMPANY.
THE ESTIMATES RANGE ANYWHERE
FROM 20 TO 40% OF THEIR COSTS
WOULD INCREASE.
WOULD UBER HAVE TO THEN PASS
THAT COST ONTO CUSTOMERS, TAKE
THAT OUT OF THE POCKETS OF
DRIVERS?
SOMETHING FUNDAMENTAL WOULD HAVE
TO CHANGE WITH THE BUSINESS
MODEL AND THERE ARE NOW, AS I
SAID, SO VALUABLE AND SO FAR
ALONG THAT THAT WOULD, YOU KNOW,
BE A MAJOR OBSTACLE FOR GROWTH
FOR THIS COMPANY.
SO THEY ARE NOT EXPLICITLY
ARGUING THAT BUT THAT'S KIND OF
WHAT FACES THIS COMPANY.
>> YOU HAVE REPORTED ON
OTHER-DEMAND COMPANIES HAVE
RECLASSIFIED THEIR CONTRACTS
NDE
WE HAVE THE CAR-PARKING SERVICE
AND INSTA CAR SHIFT.
WHY DID THEY DECIDE TO MAKE THAT
MOVE?
WHY DID THEY DECIDE TO MAKE THAT
VERY EARLY IN THEIR BUSINESS
MODELS AND THERE IS STILL TIME
TO REJIGGER THINGS AND REFRAME
THEIR BUSINESS MODELS AROUND AN
EMPLOYEE MODEL AND, TWO, WHAT
THESE COMPANIES ARE GETTING OUT
OF THIS, I TALKED TO THE CEO OF
LUX AND THEY CAN NOW DO MORE
THINGS WITH EMPLOYEES THAT THEY
COULD NOT WOULD CONTRACTORS FOR
THE ON-DEMAND VALET PARKERS.
THEY CAN SET THEIR SCHEDULES,
GIVE THEM MORE HANDS-ON TRAINING
AND GIVE THEM MORE SPECIFIC
DIRECTION THAT THEY COULD NOT DO
WITH THEIR CONTRACTOR WORKFORCE.
>> AND THEY ARE SMALL AND NIMBLE
ENOUGH TO DO AT THIS STAGE.
>> YES.
IT'S WORTH DOING IT AT THIS
STAGE BECAUSE YOU DON'T WANT TO
BE FORCED TO DO THIS CHANGE.
>> ARE YOU HEARING ANY
DISCUSSION AMONG EXECUTIVES AT
THESE TYPE OF ON-DEMAND SERVICE
COMPANIES PERHAPS ABOUT FINDING
A NEW WAY TO EXTEND EMPLOYEE
BENEFITS, BETWEEN CONTRACT AND
EMPLOYEE STATUS, PERHAPS?
>> YEAH.
WE'RE HEARING THAT FROM THE
INVESTORS AND COMPANY ITSELF AND
HEARING IT FROM REGULATORS AND
IN A NATIONAL CONVERSATION,
SENATOR OUT OF VIRGINIA HAS BEEN
A NATIONAL POLITICIAN TO DISCUSS
THIS IDEA OF, YOU KNOW,
TECHNOLOGY AND THE ONLINE
MARKETPLACES HAVE CREATED A NEW
TYPE OF WORKER.
AND TECHNOLOGY HAS MOVED FASTER
THAN REGULATION IN THIS AREA.
SHOULD WE COME UP WITH A NEW
CLASSIFICATION, A NEW TYPE OF
WORKER, SOME PEOPLE HAVE CALLED
IT THE DEPENDENT CONTRACTOR
WHERE, YOU KNOW, ESSENTIALLY
YOU'RE ACKNOWLEDGING THAT THESE
PEOPLE ARE NOT GOING TO STICK
WITH ONE COMPANY, THEY ARE NOT
GOING TO WORK A CERTAIN SHIFT
BUT THAT THEY SHOULD HAVE SOME
FUNDAMENTAL BENEFITS, LIKE, YOU
KNOW, WORKERS COMP, UNEMPLOYMENT
BENEFITS, THAT PERHAPS COULD BE
PAID OUT OF A POOL.
SO, YES, THERE IS DEFINITELY,
YOU KNOW, A NEW BEHAVIOR, A NEW
CLASS OF WORKER.
WHETHER OR NOT GOVERNMENTS AND
REGULATIONS SHOULD STEP FORWARD
AND RECOGNIZE THAT IS STILL A
MATTER OF DEBATE.
>> UBER IS ALSO FACING ANOTHER
LEGAL BATTLE IN CALIFORNIA, THE
STATE PUBLIC UTILITY COMMISSION
WANTS TO FINE THE COMPANY MORE
THAN $7 MILLION AND SUSPEND THE
SERVICE IF THE COMPANY DOESN'T
TURN OVER DATA ON RIDERS.
WHAT'S SPECIFIC DATA REGARDING
RIDERSHIP DOES THE STATE WANT TO
SEE?
>> SO SEVERAL DIFFERENT THINGS.
THEY ARE LOOKING FOR POINT A TO
POINT B, WHICH CUSTOMERS ARE
TAKING TRIPS, WHEN AND WHERE.
THEY ARE ALSO LOOKING FOR KIND
OF DATA ABOUT ACCESSIBLE
VEHICLES AND TO WHAT EXTENT UBER
IS GETTING CAN REQUESTS AND
FIELDING REQUESTS FOR ACCESSIBLE
VEHICLES.
THAT THE STATE OF CALIFORNIA IS
LOOKING FOR AND BASICALLY THEY
ARE SAYING THAT, YOU KNOW, WE
MADE A DEAL WITH YOU, UBER, THAT
WE WOULD CREATE REGULATION TO
PROTECT YOU AND YOUR SPECIFIC
KINDS OF VEHICLE AS REGULATION.
YOU'RE NOT UPHOLDING YOUR END OF
THE BARGAIN BY GIVING US ENOUGH
DATA.
I THINK THIS IS GOING TO BE A
GROWING STORY WITH UBER AS IT
BEGINS TO BECOME A LEGALIZED
ENTITY AND ADDS UBER BECOMES
PROTECTED UNDER A LOT OF LAWS IN
MANY OF THE JURISDICTIONS WHERE
IT OPERATES.
IT'S GOING TO HAVE A CHALLENGE
OF COMPLIANCE AND HOW DO YOU
MAKE SURE, YOU KNOW, THE
REGULATORS IN 50 DIFFERENT
STATES ARE ALL HAPPY WITH THE
DATA THAT YOU ARE GIVING THEM
SAND THE DEAL THAT YOU STRUCK
WITH THEM?
I THINK CALIFORNIA IS AT THE
FOREFRONT OF THIS AND WE'RE
GOING TO SEE THIS HEADACHE
EXPEND TO OTHER PLACES WITH
UBER.
>> IT'S SPENDING A LOT OF MONEY
ON LOBBYING IN CALIFORNIA.
TOP THREE OF COMPANIES IN THE
AMOUNT OF MONEY IT SPENT.
REAL QUICKLY, ARE THERE TOP
MYTHS IN THE RIDE-SHARING
ECONOMY OR IN THE ECONOMY IN
GENERAL?
>> I THINK ONE MYTH IS THAT IT'S
ALL KIND OF MOM AND POP AND IT'S
ALL THE GUY NEXT DOOR DRIVING
YOU OR RENTING YOU A PLACE.
THESE ONLINE MARKETPLACES MOVE
TOWARDS FORMALITY AND MOVE
TOWARDS THE INDUSTRY.
YOU'RE GOING TO SEE MORE AND
MORE BUSINESSES EMERGE AROUND
THESE MARKETPLACES.
>> AND THEY DO REALLY QUICKLY.
THANK YOU, DOUG.
.
>>> AND THANK YOU FOR JOINING
ALL OF US.
FOR ALL OF THE NEWS COVERAGE, GO
TO KQED.ORG.
I'M THUY VU.
TO KQED.ORG.