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  • short and to the point.

  • This is part of the new updated public awareness campaign against covered 19 hand washing is still at the forefront of the fight against the virus.

  • Every country has their own version.

  • We found this one from Vietnam.

  • However, the messages put across the it is becoming critical as numbers are reducing and China they're growing elsewhere today has seen the biggest leap and covered 19 cases in the U.

  • K so far and public health officials are, of course contact tracing.

  • But they have also said that at least three of the 32 new cases in England were passed on here, giving rise to fears that community transmission is now taking hold.

  • The four phases for dealing with this outbreak are contain.

  • That's where we are now.

  • Delay research and mitigate.

  • Today, the prime minister was asked about the potential for parliament and MPs to spread the virus, and he appeared to suggest that we are about to move from contain to delay the chief medical officer in the chief scientific adviser.

  • Together with my friend, the health center will be saying a little bit more on this couple of days about what we're going to do to delay Theat Vance of Corona bars were still at the containment stage.

  • A.

  • She will understand the distinction that the government is is making.

  • When we come to the delay phase, she will be hearing a lot more detail about what we propose to do with large gatherings in places such as Parliament.

  • It's not just large gatherings.

  • A small study following the shall A outbreak in France has found that meals at home and and restaurants could be risky.

  • For example, Transition shall A in France meal In Hong Kong.

  • We gathered about nine of these events and tried to look at the risk and an estimated that in these situations about 35% of the contacts of the case had it subsequently become infected.

  • There is a lot of happen off transmission happening.

  • Each case, an average is probably infected two or three others.

  • So if you think of the average person's number of contacts that suggest there may be a fairly high risk per contact for that amount transmission to subsequently occur.

  • The crux of the public health message is that everyone must play their part.

  • This has led to a run on hand gels.

  • This company link, oh CARE, has just received orders for one million bottles, and that's likely to increase.

  • In the meantime, a spot check on four pharmacies today found the shelves empty.

  • And what about face masks?

  • The chief medical officer has said that wearing them has almost no effect on reducing the risk of contracting the illness.

  • Today in Italy, the police raided a warehouse where masks and disinfectants of being sold online at hugely marked up prices, making money in the face of a disaster.

  • And Italy is in the midst of a crisis.

  • They've had more than 3000 cases, and today they announced that schools across the country will be closed until March the 15th.

  • So okay, I know this decision will have an impact.

  • As schools minister, I hope pupils can return to school as soon as possible.

  • On my commitment is to ensure that the essential public service orbit from the distance is provided to all our students.

  • It's a measure other countries have also taken, but one the U.

  • K government has so far resisted, experts say, their social consequences parents not being able to work, for instance, and it is still not clear how the virus is affecting the young Victoria McDonald reporting well, Italy.

  • I spoke to Dr Bruce Elbert from the World Health Organization.

  • You recently returned from China, where he collared the W H O mission on covered 19.

  • I started by asking him about Italy's decision to close universities in schools in response to the virus.

  • Frankly, they may know more than we're seeing in the news on dhe.

  • They may have concerns that are are causing them to move that way.

  • Generally, what you want to be doing, though, is looking at what are the drivers of transmission in your community?

  • Where are people getting infected and how and that should then drive what you're doing.

  • But there are many factors that affect the decisions to to to close schools.

  • Do you think that we should be thinking about closing schools in this country where the rate of infects, while the number of infections seems to be a lot lower than it is in Italy?

  • Well, I think what you want to be thinking about is, Are you doing the basics and then the graduate things up, Matt.

  • So the first thing does the whole population of, you know, the UK Do they understand what they're looking for?

  • This is not a cold.

  • It's something different.

  • Did they understand that?

  • Are they hand washing?

  • Are they doing all those preventive measures?

  • Is that rapid case isolation or identification piece in place and the ability to find the coast contacts and quarantine them et cetera, And then as you move up through those, then you start looking at okay, Do we need to suspend large gatherings because of the weight this virus is moving?

  • And no, I would agree with you.

  • It doesn't seem like like you're there yet your boss, the head of the W.

  • J, put out a mortality rate number yesterday that had us all gasping frankly, 3.4% mortality rate for those infected, which is quite a lot higher than the 1% that we were kind of dealing with roughly beforehand explained that number to us and why he's now made that public.

  • Well, when you look at the numbers in China, there's different numbers, right?

  • And I think one of the things that worried the Director General was that people were cherry picking the lowest possible numbers and they were They were underestimating what this disease could actually do.

  • And the number that you heard yesterday.

  • That's if you take from the beginning of the outbreak, including Wuhan in the area's worst hit right through to today and all of China, the number is over is over three on DDE.

  • What people often do is they just look at those provinces outside of Julia and and where Wuhan is and they calculate from once people really knew what they were doing and they say Okay, at that point it was down around 1% or under 1%.

  • But you know, what the director general was highlighting was, if you don't get on this fast, if you don't know what you're doing, if you're not taking care of your older population properly, this is going to have worse mortality than you're expecting.

  • Okay, So when you went to China, what did you discover there?

  • That should become a lesson to all of us all over the world.

  • I think the critical things that China did well where first of all the population knew what it was looking for it they knew what this disease was.

  • They knew where to go to get tested, and they could be isolated and taken care of very, very quickly.

  • People were part of the solution.

  • They were the surveillance system.

  • You weren't waiting for it to walk into hospitals and infect the hospitals.

  • They had a very well in foreign population.

  • Then they had planned the capacity to be able to isolate these debate cases, and they planned the capacity be able to find the coast contacts, quarantine them, and then take care of them for the 14 days in which 5 to 10% of them would become cases on big take wings are those.

  • And what worries me, Always mad as everyone starts with, we can't do a China did.

  • And I said, Well, why not?

  • They said, Well, we can't locked out a whole city Nice.

  • Well, China didn't either.

  • There thousands and thousands of cities, they locked down a few, which where it had really gotten out of control.

  • But still, it's a much bigger countries.

  • Well, I mean, they locked down effectively 60 million people, which is virtually the whole population of the UK.

  • Can you seriously imagine this government doing something similar in a country like ours.

  • I would be seriously surprised and frankly disappointed if the country ever got into a situation where they even have to contemplate that.

  • And the great thing you're seeing Matt, is that, you know, remember this.

  • It's not a function of the virus.

  • Whether or not you get in a situation like China's.

  • It's a function of how you respond and what you're seeing as a result of the work of public health thing than the any chess, et cetera.

  • Is there fighting these cases fast jumping on the transmission chains?

  • They're getting them under control.

  • You should never get in.

  • That situation should ever have to even contemplate it.

  • There's a big debate about closing down schools, and, of course, the Italians, you know, said they would imminently do.

  • What's the point of closing down schools of kids, according to the evidence?

  • A very unlikely to get this.

  • We actually don't know what happens with Children in this disease.

  • It appears that they're less likely to get infected.

  • It appears that the less likely to get a sick.

  • But a lot of that may be an artifact of the fact that this happened in China at the start of the Spring Festival because, remember the Spring Festival in China, all the schools are closed for two weeks, and then they extended them.

  • So we don't really know what would have happened if Children were exposed to big doses of this thing in school environment.

  • Would they have gotten sicker?

  • We don't know.

  • Probably not in my mind.

  • But would they have carried the virus back to their families and caused more outbreaks that way?

  • Quite possibly.

  • We simply don't know.

  • So one of the things we're looking at in places like Italy and and and others that get infected our do have we seen any school clusters that might other result in more sickness kids or help spread it.

  • So far, the evidence isn't there.

  • And it's one more, you know, piece of the puzzle that we haven't got the tools to study property.

  • Yet you soon will be that way.

  • Yeah, Okay.

  • Just just to bring it back to Britain, and we just had the numbers out over 80 cases now in this country.

  • It was 50 yesterday.

  • What can we infer from that?

  • Your cases are increasing.

  • Quite obviously, it's hard to infer from the number.

  • What we need to know, where they geographically clustered and clustered in time and clustered around certain events.

  • Or are these just popping up all over the country?

  • And it's It's evidence of widespread transmission that had been missed, mild cases that have been missed.

  • So the number itself doesn't tell you anything or everything.

  • What it may be telling you is the population is way more aware they're getting the much more fast, and that could be a very good sign.

  • You came back from China 10 days ago.

  • I got the one to self isolating.

  • You isolate the people who are the cases, right?

  • So I'm unclear in the not a case, I don't know because you've been tested.

  • Yes, actually, I have been tested.

  • I'm not a case.

  • Well, I'm not.

  • I'm not ill.

  • Let's say the second thing is I'm not a close contact of anyone, so I'm not quarantined.

  • So isolation is what you do for the case so the virus doesn't spread.

  • Quarantine is what you do for someone who is a contact.

  • So if they get infected, they won't spread in the meantime, but But you're not isolating in the sense of they have the virus.

  • I wasn't even.

  • Let's say a low risk contact.

  • Never came in contact with any cases.

  • Never came in contact with any known contacts.

  • Remember, I went into Wuhan.

  • 15 million people were in apartment buildings.

  • I was in a big empty bullet burned by myself.

  • Our team.

  • We think we came in less contact with people in Wuhan than anywhere I've been since Dr Bruce over.

  • Thank you very much for your time.

  • My pleasure.

  • Thank you.

  • On later in the programme will have a special report from inside Wuhan on the front line with medical staff, we see the scale of human endurance in defied to quell the virus.

  • But with Corona virus expected to spread more quickly in the weeks to come, there are serious concerns about the possibility that low paid workers will feel obliged to come to work while infected because they can't afford not to be paid.

  • Today, Boris Johnson announced that the government will be changing the rules to allow sick pay to be claimed from the first day workers for ill rather than on the fourth day as at present, Fatima Manji reports the reality of becoming unwell on the low wage has long been a hidden problem in Britain, one that the fears around Corona viruses now exposing.

  • Last night, Channel four news highlighted how contract workers in the N hs like cleaners have often been reluctant to stay at home when sick because of the financial impact.

  • One time a patient asked me, Why did you come to work sick?

  • I had to explain.

  • Unfortunately, we're not paid if we stay at home and I can't afford that being on minimum wage today, the prime minister announced emergency laws meaning all employees self isolating because of Corona virus, will now be entitled to statutory sick pay from the first day they're off.

  • It's like today announce that the health secretary will bring forward as part of our emergency Corona virus legislation measures to allow the payment of statue tree sick pay from the very first day you were sick instead of four days.

  • Under the current rules, this is only a temporary measure, but it's employers who bear the cost of it.

  • So small businesses may now demand financial support from the government, and there are many workers in Britain who won't be entitled to it all the self employed and some of those on zero hour contracts.

  • The government's directing those people to claiming universal credit so universal credit.

  • You've got the five week weights, which is no notorious on DDE.

  • That is no good.

  • And if you are at home and being told to self isolate for two weeks or more without food, maybe without some of the appliances that you need to be able to store food at home for long times like freezers, these are really vulnerable.

  • People were telling them to wait five weeks, and we know universal credit isn't working.

  • It needs to be reviewed.

  • So putting people into a system that is broken isn't going to do them any good at all.

  • The government says it will look at issues around universal credit, and claimants can apply for an advance from Day one.

  • But trade unions argue today's emergency legislation doesn't go far enough as statutory sick pays too low.

  • At £94.25 a week, the proportion of salary that statutory sick pay covers in the UK is amongst the lowest in Europe.

  • For example, Luxembourg covers 100% of employee's salaries But the UK covers just 20% of the national average wage.

  • That's beaten only by Malta, which covers 19%.

  • With officials estimating 1/5 of Britain's workforce could be sick at the peak of a Corona virus epidemic, there are urgent questions around how both employers and employees will cope financially.

  • But in the longer term, we may also need to ask if our country's sick pay system really protect the most vulnerable.

  • Well, joining me now is Mike Cherry, who's the national chairman of the Federation of Small Businesses on the T.

  • C.

  • General Secretary Front.

  • So, Grady Front security.

  • First, you've been pushing for workers to be paid from day one of going off sick.

  • He happened this announcement that while this is a Nim Porton step forward, But of course, the problem is we're still only talking about £94 a week in terms of statutory sick pay, so people still have bills to pay rent to pay £94 isn't going to cover it.

  • And, of course, we've still got two million people very often working in public, facing jobs in hospitality and retail who don't earn enough to qualify for statutory sick pay.

  • So we've been calling freelances Xerox tractors.

  • Particularly zero hours, gig hours, gig economy workers, but women on low paid workers in general who were missing out.

  • So you wanted a extended.

  • We think a workers should be entitled to proper sick pay.

  • Let me put that to you, Mike Cherry, Do you think that this offer is sort of a first installment Should be extended to freelance Is another worker Well, I think first and foremost, you need to recognize that the self employed don't get sick at the moment.

  • It all a moment.

  • So they're obviously worked for themselves.

  • They earn their own money on they're not entitled to benefits that others are for small government pay for them.

  • Well, that's a question you gotta ask government.

  • We can't answer that one.

  • Would you urge that what we would urge is government to revisit the point about statuary, sick pay, that small employers were cut out of that being able to reclaim that against their wages and salaries and national insurance on put that back in place.

  • That is a fundamental around affordability.

  • But also we would be urging any business to look at efforts.

  • Bee's Web site.

  • There is a ll the information there that you need.

  • You need to be looking at business continuity plans.

  • You need to be looking at your insurance and we are asking government HMRC in particular to give time to pay another chance to support small businesses who just don't have the money on all of this.

  • But just a pin you down on whether there should be extended or not.

  • Employers currently pay Saturday sick pay.

  • Would you like that?

  • Pay this offer today to be extended to the other workers that fronts the Grady was talking about.

  • Government has got to decide whether it can support a ll employers in the way that we are asking for if they decide that there is money available.

  • I think at the moment that the government should pay the bill rather than the employer.

  • What government is saying is that you should apply for universal credit.

  • I'm not sure that's the right answer on.

  • I think there's going to be Maur involvement on this on access to finance on HMRC, making sure that they give extended time to pay on the statue repayments that small businesses make.

  • Francis already should government be picking up a villain these emergency measures?

  • Or is it right that businesses are, as I think, is the implication of today's announcement?

  • I think one of our big concerns is that many of the so called self employed put on to self employed contracts by employers precisely to avoid paying sick pay.

  • So that's one big area of concern.

  • But let me just get him to respond to that.

  • Is that true?

  • Well, FSB support genuine self employed who just don't have the option of being able to get statuary.

  • Sick Bay full stop.

  • They need more support.

  • But when you've got these huge problems in the labor market laid bare that we have this to tear labor market system, where particularly low paid and insecure workers have so few rides, it shouldn't take a pandemic.

  • Thio for Russell to realize and the government act and reform our sick table so that everybody's you'd want the day, once a crate be made permanent.

  • Permanent?

  • Absolutely, and it should be there for all workers.

  • Do you agree with that?

  • Clearly, there's a cost implication, and there's affordability around that at the moment.

  • It's the right thing to be doing given the circumstances were in.

  • But when you say these cost implication, you believe the government should be digging into its pockets.

  • The general tax payer Rothman, looking for business, comes back to affordability.

  • At the end of the day, it is the right thing to do.

  • At the moment.

  • Small businesses, as I say, have been excluded from being able to recover the century six against the national insurance contributions that has to be reversed.

  • I think the problem is the balance of power has gone completely wrong and a ll the risk now feels like it's on the shoulders off those lowest paid workers not just for sick pay, by the way, but for pensions.

  • To what is this an opportunity to not just over a dress?

  • That imbalance is, you put it.

  • But is it also a chance to overhaul the way we weren't more home working?

  • What do you both think on that were very pro positive flexibility for workers.

  • So when it's properly agreed on DDE, where workers wanted, it's fantastic to be able to have that kind of flexibility, so it needs to be a two way street.

  • They're always going to be requirements for more people to be working from home, with Seymour self employed setting up from home.

  • Clearly, in this current circumstances, Maur are going to be asked work from home, and it's only right that they be paid appropriately in that situation.

  • But what we can't have his contract cleaners on the end of a telephone waiting to be called in for a shift and then if it's canceled, not compensated.

  • But the kind of flexibility that I think is giving Britain a bad name on that we need to address when you look a TTE What's happened in Italy, with schools being closed for two weeks and you know the sort of theory this could happen here?

  • Is there a danger in your view that some of these measures are in danger of causing some pretty catastrophic economic consequences?

  • Clearly, there's already an economic consequence when schools are shut when parents have to take time away from work to make our kids back at home.

  • This is only going to exacerbate that.

  • So employers being able to support war of their employees to work from home is an absolute must, I think, as we take this one forward for the self employed.

  • The biggest worry is that they're not going to get the work coming in in any case, and they need additional support.

  • School closures.

  • Where do you stand on?

  • I think we're gonna have to take this step by step.

  • But again, what I do know is that if schools do close, there are large numbers of workers who only get the statutory minimum of unpaid emergency leave.

  • So again, we're gonna have to have the conversation and proper consultation, I think with both business and unions about how we handle this in a way that doesn't end up with ordinary families paying the price.

short and to the point.

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