Now, one of the arguments being put forward to back that claim is thea amount of surplus vaccine being bought by wealthy countries.

現在，支持這一說法的論據之一是富國購買了大量剩餘疫苗。

Some estimates suggest they have pre ordered enough to vaccinate their entire populations three times over, making it, of course, that much harder for everyone else.

有人估計，他們已經預先訂購了足夠的疫苗，要給整個人口接種三次以上的疫苗，當然，對其他人來說，就更難了。

Toe access them well.

趾進入他們好。

Heidi Chow is with global justice now one of the organizations campaigning on the issue for People's Co vid alliance.

Heidi Chow是全球正義組織的成員，也是人民聯盟的成員之一。

Heidi, thank you very much for joining us.

海蒂，非常感謝你加入我們。

Um, there are some arguments for having mawr doses than you have people because we don't know necessarily the efficacy of all of these vaccinations on.

嗯，有一些論點有毛利劑量 比你有的人，因為我們不知道一定的功效 所有這些疫苗接種上。

And, of course, the rate at which they'll come in.

當然，還有他們進來的速度。

Is that a fair argument?

這樣的說法公平嗎？

Good morning.

早晨好

Yeah.

是啊。

Thank you for having me on.

謝謝你邀請我參加。

Yes.

是的，我知道

So the People's Vaccine Alliance is a global alliance of campaigners and organizations, and we are saying that we're seeing this gaping inequality and access to vaccines.

所以人民疫苗聯盟是一個全球的運動者和組織的聯盟，我們說我們看到了這種差距的不平等和疫苗的獲得。

So, like you said, where we might have in high income countries ability to vaccinate our populations three times over.

所以，就像你說的，我們在高收入國家可能有能力給我們的人口接種三倍以上的疫苗。

There are many countries in the world, um, especially the poorest countries in the world, which are left with virtually very little or none.

世界上有許多國家，嗯，特別是世界上最貧窮的國家，它們幾乎所剩無幾或根本沒有。

But but I suppose the point I'm making is that we don't yet know about the efficacy of all of these different vaccines on.

但我想我想說的是，我們還不知道這些不同疫苗的功效，對。

We don't actually yet know about the delivery either.

其實我們也還不知道送貨的情況。

So isn't that one of the reasons why governments are over ordering that the governments that are over ordering are actually the high income countries that are over ordering?

那麼，政府過度訂購的原因之一，是不是就是那些過度訂購的政府其實是高收入國家過度訂購？

Actually, low and middle income countries have struggled to access any of the vaccine doses a tall because most of it has been hoarded by high income countries on the time of a global pandemic.

事實上，中低收入國家很難獲得任何疫苗劑量，因為在全球大流行的時候，大部分疫苗都被高收入國家囤積起來了。

Instead of having most of the doses spoken for by high income countries, we should be actually working together collaboratively to ensure that there is a fair allocation for vulnerable groups allow at risk groups in whichever country they live in.

與其讓高收入國家說了算，不如讓我們實際合作，確保弱勢群體得到公平的分配，讓高危群體無論生活在哪個國家，都能得到公平的分配。

This is not just a solidarity on fairness argument.

這不僅僅是一個關於公平性的團結論。

It's also a public health argument because actually, when you leave vulnerable groups unvaccinated in whichever country they live in a week.

這也是一個公共衛生的論點，因為實際上，當你讓弱勢群體在哪個國家生活一週就不接種疫苗。

We get to see that the continued disruption to public health systems on and two economies.

我們可以看到，對公共衛生系統的持續破壞，對和兩個經濟體。

Yeah, of course it should.

是的，當然應該。

The criteria then be how badly affected any individual country is if it's gonna be a level playing field.

那麼標準就是任何一個國家受到的影響有多嚴重，如果它要成為一個公平的競爭環境。

I think there are two issues here.

我認為這裡有兩個問題。

The first is how do we allocate the initial supplies that we have in the world today?

第一，我們如何分配當今世界的初始物資？

Andi, we need We need countries to work together to Thio agree on the priorities for fair global allocation.

安迪，我們需要各國共同努力，就全球公平分配的優先事項達成一致。

But the more bigger issue and the more structural issue is how do we actually increase the level off off vaccine supplies?

但更大的問題和更結構性的問題是，我們如何真正提高疫苗供應的關口水準？

Because we've seen this level of hoarding because we're faced with a scarcity problem.

因為我們看到了這種程度的囤積，因為我們面臨著一個稀缺性的問題。

The world can't produce enough of pretty produce enough doses because the companies that are developing these vaccines hold the patents, the intellectual property on the technological know how on so essentially, these companies have a monopoly on DSO.

世界上不能生產足夠的漂亮的生產足夠的劑量，因為開發這些疫苗的公司擁有專利，知識產權的技術訣竅上，所以基本上，這些公司壟斷了DSO。

We have a monopoly situation and during a time of global crisis, very briefly.

我們有一個壟斷的局面，在全球危機的時候，非常短暫。

Do you have much optimism that that's something better can be achieved because there's been plenty of talk about working for everyone together very briefly.

你是否有很多樂觀的態度，那就是可以實現更好的東西，因為已經有很多人說要為大家一起努力，非常簡短。

Yeah.

是啊。

Yeah.

是啊。

There is a proposal at the World Trade Organization that's being discussed this week to actually suspend pattern rules during the pandemic.

本週世界貿易組織正在討論一項提案，即在大流行期間實際暫停模式規則。

Fork over 19 vaccines and treatment as a recognition that during this global crisis, every country should have a fair shot accessing the vaccines and the treatment that they need to get out of this pandemic together.

為19種疫苗和治療提供資金，以確認在這場全球危機中，每個國家都應該有公平的機會獲得他們所需的疫苗和治療，以共同擺脫這場大流行病。

Okay.

好吧，我知道了

Heidi Chow.

周海迪

Thank you very much indeed.

真的非常感謝你。