Name: TDA 與住房部長對話 | 《澳洲日報 (TDA speaks to the Housing Minister | The Daily Aus)
Uploaded: 2024-12-09T07:22:41.000Z
Duration: 15 min 16 s

動名詞

Claire O'Neill, thank you so much for joining The Daily Oz.

克萊爾-奧尼爾，非常感謝你參加《奧茲日報》。

to 不定詞

I'm a huge fan of this publication, so lovely to talk to you.

我是這本刊物的忠實粉絲，很高興能與您交談。

So, we hear time and time again that Australia is in a housing crisis.

是以，我們一再聽到澳洲正處於住房危機之中。

Well, what it means is that we have more or less millions of people in our country for whom housing is a life-defining challenge.

這意味著，在我國，或多或少有數百萬人的住房問題是決定他們一生的挑戰。

I'm thinking there about young people who are lining up in rental queues on a Saturday outbidding each other for a property that they may not even want to live in.

我想到的是那些在週六排隊租房的年輕人，他們互相競價購買自己可能根本不想住的房子。

It's people who've bought in really high house prices, high mortgages, who are in a cost of living crisis, struggling to be able to look after their families properly.

那些買了高房價、高抵押貸款的人正面臨著生活成本危機，他們正努力爭取能夠好好照顧自己的家人。

And perhaps most concerningly at all, it's that increasing number of people in our country who are actually falling out of the bottom of the housing market altogether into homelessness.

也許最令人擔憂的是，我國越來越多的人實際上正從住房市場的谷底跌落，淪為無家可歸者。

So these problems have been building and building in our country really for about 30 years now.

是以，這些問題在我國已經持續了 30 年。

And our government, the Albanese government, is really stepping up and trying to do something significant about this problem.

而我們的政府，阿爾巴尼塞政府，正在真正站出來，努力為解決這個問題做些重要的事情。

Can you explain why this generation is going to be worse off than their parents when it comes to housing?

你能解釋一下為什麼這一代人在住房問題上會比他們的父輩更糟糕嗎？

Well, I don't think we should quite wave the white flag on that just yet.

我認為我們還不應該就此揮舞白旗。

I think young people are going through some horrendous difficulties with housing.

我認為年輕人在住房方面正經歷著一些可怕的困難。

And the people that I'm most worried about when I look at what's going on in the housing market are absolutely young people.

當我看到住房市場的情況時，我最擔心的絕對是年輕人。

What I want young people to know is that for the first time in my lifetime, we have a Commonwealth government and state governments and local governments right around the country who are urgently trying to address some issues that frankly should have been dealt with decades ago but weren't.

我想讓年輕人知道的是，在我有生之年，我們第一次有了聯邦政府、州政府和全國各地的地方政府，他們正在緊急努力解決一些問題，坦率地說，這些問題早在幾十年前就應該解決，但卻沒有解決。

And it's going to take a little bit of time for us to address them.

我們需要一點時間來解決這些問題。

But I don't think that takes away at all from the problems that young people are experiencing today.

但我認為，這一點也不能抹殺當今年輕人遇到的問題。

They're very real and trust me, I'm talking to young people about that all the time.

它們非常真實，相信我，我一直在和年輕人談論這個問題。

所以，你已經提出了問題所在。

I just want to have a look at some of the solutions that the government's putting on the table, maybe starting with home ownership.

我只想看看政府提出的一些解決方案，也許可以從房屋所有權開始。

Your main policy in this area is called Help to Buy.

你們在這方面的主要政策叫做 "幫助購買"。

Can you just briefly explain what that is?

你能簡單解釋一下那是什麼嗎？

We have a few specific things that we're offering to first home owners.

我們為首次置業者提供了一些具體的服務。

One of those is Help to Buy, as you mentioned.

其中之一就是您提到的 "幫助購買"。

So this is a scheme that will assist 40,000 people to get into the housing market.

是以，這項計劃將幫助 40,000 人進入住房市場。

It's targeted at people who are the people who are locked out at the moment, our childcare workers, disability workers, other people who are on kind of medium or lower incomes.

它針對的是那些目前被鎖在門外的人，我們的兒童保育員、殘疾工人，以及其他中等或較低收入的人。

So that's a scheme that will affect 40,000 people.

是以，這項計劃將影響到 4 萬人。

Because that helps people put down a deposit, but does it actually address the root cause of escalating prices when it comes to housing?

因為這能幫助人們付定金，但它能真正解決住房價格不斷攀升的根本原因嗎？

And it's not targeted at bringing down house prices.

The biggest problem that we have, and if there's one thing that your listeners take from this discussion about housing, it should be this.

我們面臨的最大問題是，如果聽眾朋友們能從這次關於住房問題的討論中得到一點啟發，那就是："我們的問題是什麼？

The reason we have a housing crisis in our country is because we haven't been building enough homes.

我國之所以出現住房危機，是因為我們沒有建造足夠的住房。

So that's why you're seeing that really unsustainable house price growth, especially in some cities where there's huge pressure, like Perth, for example, is one area where house prices have gone up very, very, very high.

這就是為什麼你會看到不可持續的房價增長，尤其是在一些面臨巨大壓力的城市，比如珀斯，房價就漲得非常、非常、非常高。

The home ownership stuff is work that we are doing that gives people some immediate assistance to get into the housing market.

我們正在開展的 "房屋所有權 "工作，為人們進入住房市場提供了一些直接援助。

We're not going to fix the house price problem in our country overnight.

我們不可能在一夜之間解決我國的房價問題。

What we can do is make sure we're using our government supports to help young people get into the housing market.

我們能做的就是確保利用政府的支持，幫助年輕人進入住房市場。

So just drilling into some of the policy specifics, you mentioned that this help to buy scheme will help 40,000 people over four years.

是以，我只想深入探討一些政策細節，您提到這項幫助購買計劃將在四年內幫助四萬人。

The Greens have criticized this as being a terrible policy because it effectively creates a lottery system.

綠黨責備這是一項糟糕的政策，因為它實際上建立了一種抽籤制度。

So it starts next year, it'll be 10,000 places a year, and it won't be a lottery scheme.

是以，明年開始，每年將有 10,000 個名額，而且不是抽籤計劃。

It will be first come, first serve, and we'll see what that demand looks like.

先到先得，我們會看到需求是什麼樣的。

But if I can just say very respectfully, I mean, the way the Greens have behaved in the housing debate hasn't been fantastic.

但如果我可以非常恭敬地說，我的意思是，綠黨在住房問題辯論中的表現並不出色。

A shared equity scheme, which is what help to buy is, was part of their platform going into the 2022 election.

共有產權計劃，也就是 "幫助購買 "計劃，是他們參加 2022 年大選的政綱之一。

And they then held up our government from setting up a shared equity scheme for a really long period of time.

然後，他們在很長一段時間內阻礙了我國政府建立共享股權計劃。

We would have been able to start that scheme in the middle of this year, 2024, and it's been delayed.

我們本可以在今年年中（即 2024 年）啟動該計劃，但它被延後了。

Respectfully, I'd love to hear from other people who've got different points of view, but I'm not sure we've seen the best behavior from the Greens on this one.

恕我直言，我很想聽聽其他持不同觀點的人的意見，但我不確定綠黨在這件事上是否表現得最好。

TDA did a bit of a call out when we announced that we would be interviewing the housing minister.

當我們宣佈將對住房部長進行採訪時，TDA 做了一些呼籲。

And the number one thing that they came back with was negative gearing.

他們得出的首要結論就是負資產負債率。

What's your position on changing negative gearing?

你對改變負齒輪傳動裝置持什麼立場？

I want people to understand the reason that we have a housing crisis is because we haven't been building enough homes.

我希望人們明白，我們之所以面臨住房危機，是因為我們沒有建造足夠的住房。

With respect, Minister, we will get to supply.

恕我直言，部長，我們會提供的。

And I definitely want to ask you more about the government's plans to build more homes.

我肯定想問你更多關於政府建造更多住宅的計劃。

And the reason I'm pointing that out, Harry, is because every policy that we have, we assess from that lens.

哈里，我之所以指出這一點，是因為我們的每一項政策都是從這個角度進行評估的。

它能幫助我們建造更多的房屋嗎？

I think you'd be aware that our government looked at changes to negative gearing and capital gains tax.

我想你應該知道，我們的政府正在研究負資產負債率和資本利得稅的變化。

And we couldn't clearly show that there weren't going to be supply issues created by that.

我們無法清楚地證明這不會造成供應問題。

And so we decided not to progress with changes on negative gearing and capital gains tax.

是以，我們決定不對負資產負債率和資本利得稅進行修改。

Our policies are, we're trying to address those major supply issues, help renters get a better deal and help more Australians into home ownership.

我們的政策是，我們正在努力解決這些主要的供應問題，幫助租房者獲得更好的待遇，並幫助更多的澳大利亞人擁有住房。

And I just say also, Harry, my party took negative gearing changes to two elections and the Australian people said, well, you didn't get elected.

我還要說的是，哈里，我的政黨在兩次選舉中都採取了負資產配置改革，澳洲人民說，好吧，你沒有當選。

是以，我們已經從這場辯論中走了出來。

We're now focused on the things that are really going to make a difference and that's building more homes.

我們現在專注於真正能帶來改變的事情，那就是建造更多的房屋。

So voters have rejected it at two previous elections.

是以，在前兩次選舉中，選民們都否決了它。

Does this mean that the government will never look at changing negative gearing ever again?

這是否意味著政府再也不會考慮改變負資產負債率？

It's just not the focus and it's not being looked at at the moment.

這不是重點，目前也沒有人關注它。

And I mean, obviously I can't say what a government in 10 or 20 years time might do, but it's certainly not something that's being considered by our government.

我的意思是，顯然我不能說 10 年或 20 年後的政府會怎麼做，但這肯定不是我們的政府正在考慮的事情。

It's not something that's being considered by the government and the government's had a look at it and we've moved on.

這不是政府正在考慮的事情，政府已經對此進行了研究，我們也已經向前看了。

Moving on to renting, the Australian dream has always been to own your own home.

說到租房，澳大利亞人的夢想一直是擁有自己的房子。

Many people listening today will be in a category of people known as forever renters because they have given up on that dream.

今天收聽節目的很多人都屬於 "永遠的租房者"，因為他們已經放棄了這個夢想。

Well, I don't want them to give up on that dream.

I think it's perfectly normal to rent when you're young and you're moving around and you don't want to have big financial obligations, but certainly the aspiration of our government is not to just consider that that dream's going to end with this generation of young people.

我認為，年輕時租房是再正常不過的事了，因為你要四處漂泊，不想揹負沉重的經濟負擔，但我們政府的願望肯定不是認為這個夢想會隨著這一代年輕人的到來而終結。

We're genuinely really concerned about the idea that young people feel that they're never going to get into home ownership.

我們真的非常擔心年輕人覺得他們永遠無法擁有自己的房子。

And so the government is doing everything we can to reshape that.

是以，政府正竭盡全力重塑這一局面。

The building more homes, making sure that when you are renting, that you're in a stable and secure place, that you're not getting kicked out or treated badly like your landlord.

建造更多的房屋，確保你租住在一個穩定安全的地方，不會被房東趕走或受到不好的待遇。

And then also that work that we're doing to try to help get more young people into home ownership.

此外，我們還在努力幫助更多的年輕人置業。

Now, we're having a conversation here and you're putting the appropriate amounts of pressure on me as you should do as a journalist, but I just say to people listening at home, you know, the Commonwealth has not stepped up on housing for a long, long time in this country and you do have a Commonwealth government that's stepping in, states that are really working at this and trying to address all of those barriers that are creating those problems at the moment.

現在，我們在這裡進行對話，你們給我施加了適當的壓力，作為一名記者，你們應該這樣做，但我只想對在國內收聽廣播的人們說，你們知道，在這個國家，英聯邦已經很久很久沒有在住房問題上加大力度了，你們確實有一個英聯邦政府正在介入，各州也確實在努力解決這個問題，並試圖解決目前造成這些問題的所有障礙。

And we are going to see change that results from that.

Looking at the cost of renting, I think a lot of people listening today don't need to be reminded that renting is just getting more and more expensive.

看看租房的成本，我想今天很多人都不需要我提醒他們租房越來越貴了。

The average cost in the capital cities is $650 and the average cost in the regions is $550.

首都的平均費用為 650 美元，各地區的平均費用為 550 美元。

I know that this is a state issue, but as the country's housing minister, do you want to see caps on rent increases?

我知道這是一個州的問題，但作為該國的住房部長，您希望看到房租上漲的上限嗎？

So firstly, renters are doing it really, really tough and if there was a single thing that we could do to fix all the problems that renters are experiencing, then I would absolutely be up for that, but it's not that simple.

首先，租房者的處境非常非常艱難，如果我們能做一件事來解決租房者遇到的所有問題，那麼我絕對會支持，但事情沒那麼簡單。

So I don't support rent caps and, you know, if you bring some experts onto the show and talk to them, you'll get a really consistent answer out of them.

是以，我不支持租金上限，你知道，如果你把一些專家請到節目中與他們交談，你會從他們那裡得到非常一致的答案。

Economists in the world agree on almost nothing, but almost all of them agree that rent caps is ultimately going to create really, really serious problems.

世界上的經濟學家幾乎沒有什麼共識，但幾乎所有的經濟學家都認為，租金上限最終會帶來非常、非常嚴重的問題。

So people will stop building homes, they will stop offering their homes for renters, they will create conditions where rentals become completely rundown and atrocious to live in and basically we're not going to have a functioning housing market anymore.

是以，人們會停止建造房屋，停止為租房者提供房屋，創造條件讓租房者住在完全破舊不堪的房子裡，基本上我們就不會再有一個正常運轉的住房市場了。

So this is just the consequence of rent caps.

是以，這只是租金上限的後果。

It's why that, you know, rent caps are reasonably rare when you look at what's going on around the world.

是以，縱觀世界各國的情況，房租上限是非常罕見的。

字幕列表影片播放

TDA 與住房部長對話 | 《澳洲日報 (TDA speaks to the Housing Minister | The Daily Aus)

sort

absolutely

genuinely

debate