Defense Secretary.

國防部長。

If you missed my commentary on that event, make sure you navigate over to episode 27 of Daniel's Brew to listen to that one.

如果您錯過了我對這一事件的評論，請務必瀏覽《丹尼爾的啤酒》第 27 集收聽。

Well, in the last two days, we also had the confirmation hearing for Pam Bondi, Trump's pick for U.S. Attorney General.

在過去的兩天裡，特朗普還舉行了美國司法部長人選帕姆-邦迪（Pam Bondi）的確認聽證會。

And remember how contentious Hegseth's hearing was?

還記得黑格塞斯的聽證會有多激烈嗎？

And how the Democratic congressmen and women just completely embarrassed themselves by showing how petty and prejudiced they were against Trump's nominations?

民主黨議員和女議員們又是如何通過展示他們在反對特朗普提名時的小氣和偏見而讓自己徹底難堪的呢？

Well, the Pam Bondi hearing didn't disappoint.

帕姆-邦迪的聽證會果然沒有讓人失望。

It continued to show how those on the opposite side of the aisle showcases their disdain for anyone appointed by the incoming president.

這繼續表明，那些站在對立面的人是如何對即將上任的總統任命的任何人表示蔑視的。

Let's dive into this together.

讓我們一起深入探討。

If confirmed as the next Attorney General of the United States, my overriding objective will be to return the Department of Justice to its core mission of keeping Americans safe and vigorously prosecuting criminals.

如果被確認為下一任美國司法部長，我的首要目標將是讓司法部迴歸其核心使命，即保護美國人的安全並大力起訴罪犯。

And that includes getting back to basics, gangs, drugs, terrorists, cartels, our border, and our foreign adversaries.

這包括迴歸基本面、幫派、毒品、恐怖分子、卡特爾、我們的邊境以及我們的外國對手。

Lastly, and most importantly, if confirmed, I will fight every day to restore confidence and integrity to the Department of Justice and each of its components.

最後，也是最重要的一點，如果獲得準許，我將每天為恢復司法部及其每個部門的信心和誠信而奮鬥。

The partisanship, the weaponization will be gone.

黨派和武器化將不復存在。

America will have one tear of justice for all.

美國將為所有人帶來一滴正義之淚。

Good.

很好。

That last line about restoring confidence in the DOJ is perhaps the most important thing that Pam Bondi can do in this role.

最後一句關於恢復對司法部的信心，也許是帕姆-邦迪在這個職位上所能做的最重要的事情。

The utilization of the DOJ to personally go after Trump and other prominent conservative voices in this country has been one of the most frightening abuses of power that I've seen the government engage in in a long time.

利用司法部親自追捕特朗普和國內其他著名的保守派人士，是我長期以來看到的政府最可怕的濫用權力行為之一。

This has to stop on both sides of the aisle.

兩黨都必須停止這種做法。

And like she said, trust has to be restored, especially within this department of government.

正如她所說，必須恢復信任，尤其是在政府部門內部。

Ms. Bondi, we want an attorney general who bases decisions on facts.

邦迪女士，我們需要一位以事實為依據做出決定的總檢察長。

So I want to ask you a factual question.

所以我想問你一個事實問題。

Who won the 2020 presidential election?

誰贏得了 2020 年總統大選？

Joe Biden is the president of the United States.

喬-拜登是美國總統。

Ms. Bondi, you know that there is a difference between acknowledging it and, you know, I can say that Donald Trump won the 2024 election.

邦迪女士，你知道，承認這一點和我可以說唐納德-特朗普贏得了2024年大選是不同的。

I may not like it, but I can say it.

我可能不喜歡，但我可以說出來。

You cannot say who won the 2020 presidential election.

你不能說誰贏得了 2020 年總統大選。

Okay.

好的

It's disturbing that you can't give voice to that fact.

令人不安的是，你卻無法表達對這一事實的看法。

Oh, you said that the White House will play no role in investigative or charging decisions in the DOJ.

哦，你說白宮不會在司法部的調查或指控決定中扮演任何角色。

Is that correct?

是這樣嗎？

Senator, what I said is that it is the Department of Justice's decision to determine what cases will be prosecuted.

參議員，我說的是，司法部決定起訴哪些案件。

What role will the White House have in investigative or prosecutorial decisions of the DOJ?

白宮將在司法部的調查或起訴決定中扮演什麼角色？

It is the Department of Justice's decision, Senator.

這是司法部的決定，參議員。

So that sounds to me that you're saying that the White House will not have any kind of role.

所以在我看來，你的意思是白宮不會扮演任何角色。

So you have an incoming president who said, I have the absolute right to do what I want to do with the Justice Department.

即將上任的總統說，我有絕對的權利對司法部為所欲為。

And in fact, President-elect Trump considers the DOJ to be his law firm.

事實上，當選總統特朗普認為司法部就是他的律師事務所。

Ask you this.

問你一個問題。

If President-elect Trump asks, suggests, or hints that you as Attorney General should investigate one of his perceived political enemies, would you do so?

如果當選總統特朗普要求、建議或暗示您作為司法部長調查他認為的政敵之一，您會這樣做嗎？

Senator Hirono, I wish you had met with me.

希羅諾參議員，我希望你能和我見一面。

Had you met with me, we could have discussed many things and gotten to know-

如果你和我見面，我們本可以討論很多事情，瞭解

I am listening to you now.

我現在在聽你說。

You could have gotten to know me.

你本可以瞭解我的

Could you respond to the question?

您能回答這個問題嗎？

Yeah, you were the only one who refused to meet with me, Senator.

是啊，你是唯一一個拒絕見我的人，參議員。

But what we would have discussed is that it is the job of the Attorney General to follow the law.

但我們要討論的是，司法部長的職責是遵守法律。

I'm very happy to listen to your responses under oath, Ms. Bondi.

我很樂意聽取你宣誓後的回答 邦迪女士

So I think it's really important to us that the Attorney General be independent.

是以，我認為司法部長的獨立性對我們來說非常重要。

So first, you'll hear this question a lot from all the Democratic congressional men and women in this hearing, all of them terrified that Trump will go after his political opponents through the DOJ.

是以，首先，在這次聽證會上，你會從所有民主黨議員那裡聽到很多這個問題，他們都很害怕特朗普會通過司法部來對付他的政治對手。

It's such a hypocritical question, given that this is what the Biden administration has been doing all throughout these four years.

這是一個多麼虛偽的問題，因為拜登政府在這四年裡一直都在這麼做。

But Pam does do a good job of answering the question in a neutral manner, stating that the DOJ is independent, making decisions of whether or not to investigate any party within themselves.

但帕姆確實以中立的方式很好地回答了這個問題，她說司法部是獨立的，由他們自己決定是否調查任何一方。

But a better answer would have been that the DOJ would investigate anyone in which there is sufficient cause or sufficient reason to pursue, even if that happens to be a political opponent of Trump's.

但更好的答案應該是，只要有足夠的原因或理由，司法部就會對任何人進行調查，即使那人恰好是特朗普的政治對手。

Being a political opponent of Trump does not absolve you of any wrongdoing in government.

作為特朗普的政治反對派並不能免除你在政府中的任何不法行為。

And if there is sufficiently reasonable justification for going after a person that was an enemy of Trump, then the DOJ would independently make that judgment call and take the right course of action.

如果有足夠合理的理由追捕特朗普的敵人，那麼司法部會獨立做出判斷並採取正確的行動。

You see, the Democratic line of questioning on this topic continues to harp on the fear that Trump's opponents might be targeted by the DOJ.

你看，民主黨在這個問題上的提問思路仍然是擔心特朗普的反對者會成為司法部的目標。

But if there are certain people that happen to be Trump's opponents that have acted in an illegal and severely detrimental fashion, then they would deserve to be investigated.

但是，如果有某些人恰好是特朗普的對手，他們的行為是非法的、嚴重有害的，那麼他們就理應受到調查。

Whether if the president suggests, hints, asks, that you as attorney general should investigate one of his perceived enemies?

如果總統建議、暗示、要求你作為總檢察長調查他認為的敵人之一，你是否會這麼做？

Senator, I certainly have not heard the president say that, but what I will tell you is two thirds of Americans have lost faith in the Department of Justice.

參議員，我當然沒有聽到總統這麼說，但我要告訴你的是，三分之二的美國人已經對司法部失去了信心。

And it's statements like that, I believe, that make people continue to lose faith.

我相信，正是這樣的言論讓人們不斷失去信心。

If I am confirmed as attorney general, it will be my job to not only keep America safe, but restore integrity to that department.

如果我被任命為總檢察長，我的職責不僅是確保美國的安全，還要恢復該部門的廉正。

And that's what I plan on doing every single day as attorney general.

作為總檢察長，我計劃每天都這麼做。

On August 25th, 2025, on Fox News, you said, when Republicans take back the White House, the Department of Justice, the prosecutors who will be prosecuted, the bad ones, the investigators who will be investigated, Ms. Bondi, is Jack Smith one of those bad prosecutors that you will prosecute as AG?

2025年8月25日，您在福克斯新聞節目中說，當共和黨人奪回白宮、司法部後，將起訴那些不好的檢察官、調查人員，邦迪女士，傑克-史密斯是您作為總檢察長將起訴的那些不好的檢察官之一嗎？

Senator, you hesitated a bit when I said the bad ones.

參議員，當我說 "壞的 "時，你有點猶豫。

Every decision will be made in the eyes of the beholder.

每一個決定都將在觀察者的眼中做出。

I'm just asking whether you would consider Jack Smith to be one of the people.

我只是想問，你是否認為傑克-史密斯是其中一員。

How about Liz Cheney?

莉茲-切尼怎麼樣？

Senator, how about Merrick Garland?

參議員，梅里克-加蘭怎麼樣？

I am not going to answer hypotheticals.

我不會回答假設性問題。

No one has been prejudged, nor will anyone be prejudged if I am confirmed.

沒有人被預先判斷，如果我被確認，也不會有人被預先判斷。

These are, in fact, the people that you would prosecute.

事實上，這些人就是你們要起訴的人。

Your time is up.

你的時間到了

Honestly, this is why the American public thinks our government is such a joke.

老實說，這就是為什麼美國公眾認為我們的政府是個笑話。

That lady is Maisie Hirono, the junior U.S. senator from Hawaii.

這位女士就是梅西-博野（Maisie Hirono），來自夏威夷的資歷較淺的美國參議員。

Not only was she so unprepared that she was literally reading off her notes when she was asking Pam Bondi her questions, but she spent all of her time talking over Pam immediately after finishing her question.

她不僅毫無準備，在向帕姆-邦迪（Pam Bondi）提問時簡直就是在照本宣科，而且在帕姆提問結束後，她馬上就把所有時間都花在了對帕姆的談話上。

And notice that Pam gave her the perfect answer by saying that two-thirds of the American people have lost trust in the DOJ because of the perception of bias and partisanship that exudes from the likes of questions that Hirono asked.

請注意，帕姆給了她一個完美的答案，她說三分之二的美國人已經失去了對司法部的信任，因為從赫羅諾夫提出的類似問題中，人們感受到了偏見和黨派性。

It boggles my mind how many C-students we have in government.

我不知道政府中有多少 C 級學生。

And when you see such empty, fatuous moments of what is simply an exercise of these risible people hearing themselves talk, the denseness of our current government is on full display.

當你看到這些空洞、虛假的時刻，這些可笑的人只是在聽自己說話，我們當前政府的孱弱就一覽無餘了。

How about asking her a question on her experience?

就她的經歷向她提問如何？

How about asking her a perspective on how she plans to restore trust in the DOJ?

不如問問她打算如何恢復人們對司法部的信任？

How about asking her her opinion on what type of tactical overhaul she would work on first when she takes into office?

不如問問她的意見，她上任後將首先致力於哪種類型的戰術改革？

How about asking her anything except partisan questions that are politically charged and aimed at extracting a questionable soundbite that can be used and misconstrued to attack the other side of the aisle?

除了那些帶有政治色彩的、旨在榨取一個可以被利用和曲解來攻擊過道另一側的可疑段子的黨派問題之外，問她任何問題如何？

How about that?

怎麼樣？

I thought the exchange just a moment ago with Senator Hirono was illustrative.

我認為剛才與希羅諾參議員的交流很能說明問題。

She asked you how you would respond if the president asked you to target his political enemies.

她問你，如果總統要求你針對他的政敵，你會如何迴應。

It's rather striking because it's not a hypothetical.

這一點相當引人注目，因為它不是一個假設。

It has happened over the last four years.

這種情況在過去四年中已經發生。

And I think perhaps the most tragic legacy of the Biden-Harris administration has been the politicization and the weaponization of the United States Department of Justice.

我認為拜登-哈里斯政府留下的最悲慘的遺產也許就是美國司法部的政治化和武器化。

And we don't need to ask hypothetically because Joe Biden publicly mused and allowed the New

我們不需要假設性地提問，因為喬-拜登曾公開思索並允許《新

York Times to report it, calling on Merrick Garland, why will he not prosecute Trump more quickly?

紐約時報》報道此事，呼籲梅里克-加蘭，他為什麼不更快地起訴特朗普？

And Merrick Garland, sadly, he sat in that chair and promised to be apolitical, and he broke that promise almost the instant he walked into the Department of Justice.

可悲的是，梅里克-加蘭坐在那把椅子上，承諾不參與政治，但他幾乎在走進司法部的一瞬間就違背了承諾。

If you look on the West pediment of the Supreme Court of the United States, just above the entrance, there's a simple yet profound four-word phrase, equal justice under law.

在美國最高法院入口處的西側楣板上，有一個簡單而深刻的四字短語，即 "法律面前人人平等"。

We have seen over the last four years a Department of Justice that systematically targeted the political opponents of Joe Biden and Kamala Harris, and that systematically protected his friends and allies.

在過去四年中，我們看到司法部有計劃地針對喬-拜登和卡馬拉-哈里斯的政治對手，有計劃地保護他的朋友和盟友。

And it is tragic to see the loss of confidence in the American people in the Department of

看到美國人民對美國國務院失去信心是可悲的。

Justice and in the FBI.

司法部門和聯邦調查局。

I would note, I don't think there's an institution in America who has lost more respect from the American people than the FBI has in the last four years.

我想說的是，我不認為美國有哪個機構比聯邦調查局在過去四年裡更失去美國人民的尊重。

That is a grotesque violation of the obligation of the Department of Justice and the FBI.

這是對司法部和聯邦調查局義務的荒唐踐踏。

So I want to start with just a very simple question.

所以，我想先問一個非常簡單的問題。

If you are confirmed as attorney general, will you pledge to fairly and faithfully uphold the law regardless of party?

如果您被確認為總檢察長，您是否會承諾不分黨派，公正、忠實地維護法律？

So help me God.

上帝保佑我

Amen.

阿門

Look, and I want to be clear for folks at home.

聽著，我想對家裡的人說清楚。

I don't want a Republican Department of Justice.

我不想要共和黨的司法部。

I don't want a Democrat Department of Justice.

我不想要一個民主黨司法部。

I want a Department of Justice that follows the damn law.

我想要一個遵守該死的法律的司法部。

Good.

很好。

I'm not the only one that was irritated by the hypocrisy of these questions.

我不是唯一一個被這些問題的虛偽所激怒的人。

Good job to Senator Ted Cruz for responding to the blatant bias exhibited by Hirono.

參議員特德-克魯茲（Ted Cruz）對赫羅諾（Hirono）公然表現出的偏見做出了迴應，這一點做得很好。

And he's absolutely right.

他說得完全正確。

We don't want another partisan DOJ.

我們不想要另一個有黨派之分的司法部。

We want one that's fair and upholds the integrity of the law.

我們需要的是一個公平的、維護法律公正的機構。

And like Mr. Giuliani, as you've noted today, you've taken an oath to uphold the Constitution just as an attorney.

和朱利安尼先生一樣，正如你今天所指出的，你作為一名律師宣誓維護憲法。

And now you're asking us to consider you to serve as the chief law enforcement officer in our country.

現在，你要求我們考慮讓你擔任我國的首席執法官。

So it's imperative, Mr. Fondi, that you subscribe to facts and evidence and not politically convenient conspiracy theories.

是以，方迪先生，你必須接受事實和證據，而不是政治上方便的陰謀論。

Your job will be, I'm speaking, your job will be to protect voters and election workers, not to undermine and dox them.

你的工作是，我是說，你的工作是保護選民和選舉工作人員，而不是破壞和誹謗他們。

Now I know that earlier you agreed that Joe Biden is in fact president, but many of the president-elect's inner circle continue to spread the big lie about the 2020 election.

現在我知道，早些時候你同意喬-拜登實際上是總統，但當選總統的許多核心圈子仍在繼續散佈關於 2020 年大選的彌天大謊。

Then we'll move on to a different topic.

然後，我們再換個話題。

Senator, you were speaking, may I speak?

參議員，您正在發言，我可以發言嗎？

You cut me off when I was speaking.

你在我說話的時候打斷了我。

You cut me off when I was speaking.

你在我說話的時候打斷了我。

I hope you answer, Ms. Fondi.

希望您能回答，方迪女士。

Well, I'd like to answer the previous one, Senator.

參議員，我想回答前一個問題。

When we met yesterday, you did not seem to be familiar with the citizenship clause of the United States of America, which was deeply disappointing.

我們昨天見面時，您似乎並不熟悉美利堅合眾國的公民權條款，這令人深感失望。

I guess you didn't want to hear my answer about Pennsylvania.

我猜你不想聽我關於賓夕法尼亞州的回答。

After I gave an opportunity to study overnight.

之後，我給了他一個通宵學習的機會。

So can you tell me in this committee what the citizenship clause of the 14th Amendment says?

那麼，你能在這個委員會里告訴我第 14 修正案的公民權條款是怎麼規定的嗎？

Senator, I'm here to answer your questions.

參議員，我是來回答您的問題的。

I'm not here to do your homework and study for you.

我不是來替你做作業和學習的。

If I am confirmed as Attorney General.

如果我被確認為司法部長。

You're the one asking for a confirmation vote, ma'am.

是你要求進行確認投票的，女士。

Hey, you cut me off.

嘿，你打斷我了

Can I please finish?

我能說完嗎？

What does the 14th Amendment say?

第 14 修正案怎麼說？

Senator, Senator, the 14th Amendment we all know addresses birthright citizenship.

參議員，參議員，我們都知道第 14 條修正案涉及出生公民權。

I've been a state prosecutor.

我當過州檢察官

I've been a state AG.

我當過州檢察長。

I look forward to even given your remarks today, working with you and the people of

我期待著聆聽您今天的發言，並與您和

California if I am confirmed as the 87th Attorney General of the United States of

如果我被確認為美國第 87 任司法部長，加利福尼亞州

America.

美國。

I didn't take your homework assignment.

我沒有接受你的家庭作業。

I'm sorry.

對不起

I was preparing for today.

我在為今天做準備。

So on the 14th Amendment, now you've testified repeatedly to this committee that you will uphold the laws of this country and defend the Constitution of the United States.

關於第十四修正案，你曾多次向本委員會作證，表示你將維護國家法律，捍衛美國憲法。

Do you believe birthright citizenship is the law of the land and will you defend it regardless of a child born in the United States, regardless of their parents' immigration status?

您是否認為與生俱來的公民權是美國的法律，無論孩子出生在美國與否，無論其父母的移民身份如何，您都會捍衛這一權利？

Senator, I will study birthright citizenship.

參議員，我會研究與生俱來的公民權。

I would love to meet with you regarding birthright citizenship.

我很樂意就出生公民權問題與您會面。

Can I answer the question?

我能回答這個問題嗎？

Ma'am, you're asking us to consider you to serve as the Attorney General of the United

女士，您要求我們考慮由您擔任美國司法部長。

States and you still need to study the 14th Amendment of the Constitution?

你還需要研究憲法第 14 修正案嗎？

That is not helping me have more confidence in your ability to do this job.

這並不能讓我對你的工作能力更有信心。

Let me take a step back and outline the fact that these confirmation hearings are supposed to be interviews, interviews to see whether or not the candidate in question is fully qualified to do the job they're seeking.

讓我退一步概述一下，這些確認聽證會本應是面試，面試的目的是瞭解相關候選人是否完全有資格勝任他們所尋求的工作。

When you have lines of questioning like you just had from Senator Padilla from California, all you see is political theater designed to attack the other political party.

像加利福尼亞州參議員帕迪利亞這樣的質詢，你看到的只是旨在攻擊對方政黨的政治戲劇。

I mean, literally, what substance did we glean from those few minutes of questioning?

我的意思是，從字面上看，我們從那幾分鐘的質詢中得到了什麼實質內容？

Did we learn anything new about Pam's credentials or her background?

我們對帕姆的資歷和背景有什麼新的瞭解嗎？

Did we learn anything that might help us understand how Pam might operate or think in her new role?

我們是否瞭解到任何有助於我們理解帕姆在新角色中如何運作或思考的資訊？

Of course we didn't.

我們當然沒有。

Imagine if you're on an interview panel to hire a person at your work.

想象一下，如果你是面試小組成員，要在你的工作組織、部門招聘一個人。

And one of your colleagues on that panel comes in with a preconceived notion of mistrust and bias against the candidate and then asks a bunch of questions aimed at attacking our new boss.

而小組中的一位同事帶著對候選人的不信任和偏見，先入為主地問了一堆問題，目的就是攻擊我們的新老闆。

The behavior of these senior 50 to 60-year-old Democrat politicians is just so embarrassing.

這些五六十歲的民主黨資深政客的行為實在令人尷尬。

I too have taken note of the number of times you have been asked about weaponization of the Department of Justice as if it was a theoretical possibility that might happen in the future.

我也注意到，你曾多次被問及司法部武器化的問題，好像這是未來可能發生的理論上的可能性。

One of my colleagues on the other side said, weaponization may well occur under your tenure.

我在另一方的一位同事說，在你的任期內，武器化很可能會發生。

We all know that weaponization has occurred like we've never seen before in American history under this administration.

我們都知道，在本屆政府的上司下，武器化已經發生了美國曆史上前所未有的情況。

And I want to get even more specific.

我想說得更具體一些。

In the last four years, this administration has carried out an unprecedented attack and campaign against people of faith.

在過去的四年裡，本屆政府對信仰者發起了前所未有的攻擊和運動。

If you look at the numbers, we've never seen anything like it before in American history.

如果你看一下數字，我們在美國曆史上從未見過這樣的事情。

It has been one of the most disgraceful chapters in the history of the Justice Department and in the history of the FBI.