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  • Have you ever wondered

    你有沒有想過

  • why extremism seems to have been on the rise in Muslim-majority countries

    為什麼在過去十年歷程在穆斯林佔多數的國家

  • over the course of the last decade?

    極端主義似乎有上升?

  • Have you ever wondered

    你有沒有想過

  • how such a situation can be turned around?

    這樣的情況如何可以翻轉?

  • Have you ever looked at the Arab uprisings

    你有沒有在看阿拉伯起義時

  • and thought, "How could we have predicted that?"

    想著: 「我們怎樣能預測這件事情呢?」

  • or "How could we have better prepared for that?"

    或「我們怎麼能更充分的準備呢?」

  • Well my personal story, my personal journey,

    那麼這是我個人的故事,我個人的旅程,

  • what brings me to the TED stage here today,

    是為什麼我今天在TED這裡,

  • is a demonstration of exactly what's been happening

    準確演示在在過去至少幾十年

  • in Muslim-majority countries

    或甚至更長時間內

  • over the course of the last decades, at least, and beyond.

    穆斯林佔多數的國家發生過什麼。

  • I want to share some of that story with you,

    我想與你分享一些故事,

  • but also some of my ideas around change

    並且也有一些我認為轉變的想法

  • and the role of social movements in creating change

    及社會運動對改變

  • in Muslim-majority societies.

    穆斯林佔多數社會的角色。

  • So let me begin

    如果我可以放任發揮,

  • by first of all giving a very, very brief history of time,

    讓我首先給你的一個

  • if I may indulge.

    非常非常濃縮的歷史簡介。

  • In medieval societies there were defined allegiances.

    在中世紀社會中忠誠是有定義的。

  • An identity was defined

    一個身份的定義

  • primarily by religion.

    主要是來自宗教。

  • And then we moved on into an era in the 19th century

    然後我們就進入在19世紀時代

  • with the rise of a European nation-state

    歐洲民族國家的身份

  • where identities and allegiances were defined

    和忠誠的定義

  • by ethnicity.

    是來自種族。

  • So identity was primarily defined by ethnicity,

    因此,種族主要是界定身份,

  • and the nation-state reflected that.

    而國家民族也反映如同。

  • In the age of globalization, we moved on.

    在全球化時代,我們繼續前行。

  • I call it the era of citizenship --

    我把它稱為公民的時代 --

  • where people could be from multi-racial, multi-ethnic backgrounds,

    人們可以從多種族化,多民族化的背景,

  • but all be equal as citizens

    但都被視為一個國家

  • in a state.

    的平等公民。

  • You could be American-Italian; you could be American-Irish;

    你可能是美國的意大利人,你可能是美國的愛爾蘭人,

  • you could be British-Pakistani.

    你可能是英國巴基斯坦人。

  • But I believe now

    但我相信現在

  • that we're moving into a new age,

    我們正在進入一個新的時代,

  • and that age The New York Times dubbed recently

    而且最近這個時代被紐約時報

  • as "the age of behavior."

    稱為「 行為的時代」。

  • How I define the age of behavior

    我如何定義行為的時代

  • is a period of transnational allegiances,

    是以一個跨國的忠誠準則,

  • where identity is defined more so

    其中身份的標定是指

  • by ideas and narratives.

    思想和敘事。

  • And these ideas and narratives that bump people across borders

    而這些越來越多的理念和敘事

  • are increasingly beginning to affect

    而簸動人們跨越國界開始影響

  • the way in which people behave.

    人們的行為。

  • Now this is not all necessarily good news,

    這並不一定是個好消息,

  • because it's also my belief

    因為我也相信,

  • that hatred has gone global

    仇恨跟愛一樣

  • just as much as love.

    已經全球化。

  • But actually it's my belief

    但實際上我是相信,

  • that the people who've been truly capitalizing on this age of behavior,

    已經真正把握這種行為的人,

  • up until now, up until recent times,

    到現在為止,直到近代,

  • up until the last six months,

    直到最近6個月,

  • the people who have been capitalizing most

    最能利用

  • on the age of behavior

    行為時代的人們

  • and the transnational allegiances,

    和跨國忠誠,

  • using digital activism

    用激進的數據化

  • and other sorts of borderless technologies,

    和其他各種無國界的技術,

  • those who've been benefiting from this

    那些已經從中受益的

  • have been extremists.

    是極端分子。

  • And that's something which I'd like to elaborate on.

    這便是我想闡述的東西。

  • If we look at Islamists,

    如果我們看一下伊斯蘭主義,

  • if we look at the phenomenon

    如果我們看一下

  • of far-right fascists,

    在極右翼法西斯的現象,

  • one thing they've been very good at,

    他們有一點已經很好,

  • one thing that they've actually been exceeding in,

    他們實際上已經超過這一點,

  • is communicating across borders,

    是跨越國界的通信,

  • using technologies to organize themselves,

    採用技術組織起來,

  • to propagate their message

    傳播他們的信息,

  • and to create truly global phenomena.

    並建立真正的全球性現象。

  • Now I should know,

    現在我應該知道,

  • because for 13 years of my life,

    因為我13年的生活,

  • I was involved in an extreme Islamist organization.

    我是在參與一個極端的伊斯蘭組織。

  • And I was actually a potent force

    而實際上我是一個在傳播

  • in spreading ideas across borders,

    跨越國界的想法的強大力量。

  • and I witnessed the rise of Islamist extremism

    我親眼目睹了伊斯蘭極端主義的興起,

  • as distinct from Islam the faith,

    顯明不同於伊斯蘭教的信仰,

  • and the way in which it influenced my co-religionists

    和影響了我在世界各地教友

  • across the world.

    作為的和方式。

  • And my story, my personal story,

    而我的故事,我個人的故事,

  • is truly evidence for the age of behavior

    是真正的行為時代的證據,

  • that I'm attempting to elaborate upon here.

    我試圖在這裡闡述的憑證。

  • I was, by the way -- I'm an Essex lad,

    順帶一提我 -- 我是個埃塞克斯郡的小伙子,

  • born and raised in Essex in the U.K.

    在埃塞克斯郡出生和成長。

  • Anyone who's from England

    任何人如來自英格蘭

  • knows the reputation we have from Essex.

    都知道我們這些來自埃塞克斯郡的聲譽。

  • But having been born in Essex,

    但出生在埃塞克斯郡,

  • at the age of 16,

    16歲,

  • I joined an organization.

    我加入了一個組織。

  • At the age of 17, I was recruiting people from Cambridge University

    在17歲,我從劍橋大學

  • to this organization.

    招募人員加入這個組織。

  • At the age of 19,

    在19歲,

  • I was on the national leadership of this organization in the U.K.

    我已是成為在英國的國家首領。

  • At the age of 21, I was co-founding this organization in Pakistan.

    在21歲,我在巴基斯坦共同創辦了這個組織。

  • At the age of 22,

    在22歲,

  • I was co-founding this organization in Denmark.

    我在丹麥共同創辦了這個組織。

  • By the age of 24,

    到了24歲,

  • I found myself convicted in prison in Egypt,

    我在埃及被定罪進入監獄裡,

  • being blacklisted from three countries in the world

    在世界上三個國家的黑名單

  • for attempting to overthrow their governments,

    被控企圖推翻他們的政府,

  • being subjected to torture

    在埃及監獄

  • in Egyptian jails

    遭受酷刑,

  • and sentenced to five years as a prisoner of conscience.

    並被判處為一個良心犯五年。

  • Now that journey,

    現在那一個旅程,

  • and what took me from Essex all the way across the world --

    什麼把我從埃塞克斯郡帶到跨越世界--

  • by the way, we were laughing at democratic activists.

    順便說一下,我們在嘲諷民主活動家。

  • We felt they were from the age of yesteryear.

    我們認為那些人是從昔日的時代。

  • We felt that they were out of date.

    我們覺得他們是過時的。

  • I learned how to use email

    我從極端組織

  • from the extremist organization that I used.

    學會了如何使用電子郵件。

  • I learned how to effectively communicate across borders

    我學會了如何有效地跨越國界溝通,

  • without being detected.

    而不被發現。

  • Eventually I was detected, of course, in Egypt.

    當然, 最後我被發現,在埃及。

  • But the way in which I learned

    不過,我學會了

  • to use technology to my advantage

    使用技術盡用優勢,

  • was because I was within an extremist organization

    是因為我是在極端主義組織

  • that was forced to think beyond

    被迫去思考超越

  • the confines of the nation-state.

    民族國家的範圍內。

  • The age of behavior: where ideas and narratives

    行為的年代:越來越多地以思想和說明

  • were increasingly defining behavior

    定義行為,

  • and identity and allegiances.

    身份和忠誠。

  • So as I said, we looked to the status quo

    因此,正如我所說的,我們看到現狀,

  • and ridiculed it.

    而嘲笑它。

  • And it's not just Islamist extremists that did this.

    而且不只是伊斯蘭極端分子這樣做的。

  • But even if you look across

    但是,即使你看如今,

  • the mood music in Europe of late,

    在歐洲極右的法西斯主義的

  • far-right fascism is also on the rise.

    音樂情緒也在上升。

  • A form of anti-Islam rhetoric

    反伊斯蘭言論的形式

  • is also on the rise

    也呈上升趨勢,

  • and it's transnational.

    和跨越國界。

  • And the consequences that this is having

    這後果便是

  • is that it's affecting the political climate

    影響了整個歐洲的

  • across Europe.

    政治氣候。

  • What's actually happening

    實際發生的是,

  • is that what were previously localized parochialisms,

    以前本地化的本位主義,

  • individual or groupings of extremists

    個人或彼此孤立的

  • who were isolated from one another,

    極端分子集團,

  • have become interconnected in a globalized way

    已在一個全球化的方式相互關聯,

  • and have thus become, or are becoming, mainstream.

    並因此成為或正在成為主流。

  • Because the Internet and connection technologies

    由於互聯網連接技術,

  • are connecting them across the world.

    連接世界各地。

  • If you look at the rise of far-right fascism across Europe of late,

    如果你看一下現時在整個歐洲崛起的極右法西斯主義,

  • you will see some things that are happening

    你會看到一些事情正在發生,

  • that are influencing domestic politics,

    影響到國內政治,

  • yet the phenomenon is transnational.

    但這種現象是跨越國界。

  • In certain countries, mosque minarets are being banned.

    在某些國家,清真寺的尖塔被禁止。

  • In others, headscarves are being banned.

    在其他國家,頭巾都被禁止。

  • In others, kosher and halal meat are being banned,

    在其他國家,猶太教和

  • as we speak.

    伊斯蘭教的肉正在被禁止。

  • And on the flip side,

    而在另一面,

  • we have transnational Islamist extremists

    我們有跨國伊斯蘭極端分子

  • doing the same thing across their own societies.

    在其自己的社會做同樣的事情。

  • And so they are pockets of parochialism that are being connected

    所以, 本位主義正在連接的方式

  • in a way that makes them feel like they are mainstream.

    使他們覺得他們是主流。

  • Now that never would have been possible before.

    在以前這個永遠不會有可能。

  • They would have felt isolated,

    他們會感到孤立的,

  • until these sorts of technologies came around

    直到這些技術來臨

  • and connected them in a way

    連接了周圍,

  • that made them feel part of a larger phenomenon.

    使他們覺得是一個大現象的一部分。

  • Where does that leave democracy aspirants?

    民主追求者可以去哪裡?

  • Well I believe they're getting left far behind.

    我相信他們遠遠被拋在後面。

  • And I'll give you an example here at this stage.

    我給你舉個現階段的例子。

  • If any of you remembers the Christmas Day bomb plot:

    如果你記得聖誕節炸彈陰謀:

  • there's a man called Anwar al-Awlaki.

    有一個名Anwar Al-Awlaki的人。

  • As an American citizen, ethnically a Yemeni,

    作為一個美國公民,種族也門,

  • in hiding currently in Yemen,

    目前藏匿在也門,

  • who inspired a Nigerian,

    他激發了一個尼日利亞人,

  • son of the head of Nigeria's national bank.

    尼日利亞國家銀行負責人的兒子。

  • This Nigerian student studied in London, trained in Yemen,

    這個尼日利亞學生在倫敦學習,在也門訓練,

  • boarded a flight in Amsterdam to attack America.

    登上了在阿姆斯特丹的航班襲擊美國。

  • In the meanwhile,

    在此同時,

  • the Old mentality with a capital O,

    一個舊思維的思想,

  • was represented by his father, the head of the Nigerian bank,

    他的父親作為代表--尼日利亞銀行的負責人,

  • warning the CIA that his own son was about to attack,

    警告中央情報局自己兒子的攻擊計劃,

  • and this warning fell on deaf ears.

    但警告置若罔聞。

  • The Old mentality with a capital O,

    一個舊思維的思想,

  • as represented by the nation-state,

    民族國家作為代表,

  • not yet fully into the age of behavior,

    尚未完全融入行為的時代,

  • not recognizing the power of transnational social movements,

    不承認跨國社會運動的力量,

  • got left behind.

    舊的思維被落後。

  • And the Christmas Day bomber almost succeeded

    聖誕節轟炸機幾乎成功地

  • in attacking the United States of America.

    攻擊美國。

  • Again with the example of the far right:

    再與最右端的例子:

  • that we find, ironically,

    我們發現,具有諷刺意味的是,

  • xenophobic nationalists

    仇外的民族主義者

  • are utilizing the benefits of globalization.

    正在利用全球化帶來的好處。

  • So why are they succeeding?

    那麼,為什麼他們成功?

  • And why are democracy aspirants falling behind?

    為什麼民主主義落後。

  • Well we need to understand the power of the social movements who understand this.

    我們需要了解明白社會運動的力量的這一點。

  • And a social movement is comprised, in my view,

    社會運動,在我看來,

  • it's comprised of four main characteristics.

    是由四個主要特點組成。

  • It's comprised of ideas and narratives

    它是以思想, 敘事

  • and symbols and leaders.

    象徵和領導組成。

  • I'll talk you through one example,

    讓我討論一個例子,

  • and that's the example that everyone here will be aware of,

    一個這裡的每一個人都知道的例子,

  • and that's the example of Al-Qaeda.

    那例子便是基地組織。

  • If I asked you to think of the ideas of Al-Qaeda,

    如果我問你你認為基地組織的概念是什麼,

  • that's something that comes to your mind immediately.

    立即便有東西來到你的腦內。

  • If I ask you to think of their narratives --

    如果我問你你認為他們的敘述是什麼 --

  • the West being at war with Islam, the need to defend Islam against the West --

    西方在與伊斯蘭教的戰爭,伊斯蘭對西方捍衛的需要 --

  • these narratives, they come to your mind immediately.

    這些敘事,它們立即來到你的腦內。

  • Incidentally, the difference between ideas and narratives:

    順便說一說,概念和敘述之間的差異:

  • the idea is the cause that one believes in;

    概念是令人相信的原因;

  • and the narrative is the way to sell that cause --

    而敘事便是推銷原因的方式 --

  • the propaganda, if you like, of the cause.

    那就是, 政治宣傳原因。

  • So the ideas and the narratives of Al-Qaeda come to your mind immediately.

    因此基地組織的敘述的概念便立即來到你的腦內。

  • If I ask you to think of their symbols and their leaders,

    如果我要你認出他們的象徵和領導人,

  • they come to your mind immediately.

    他們便立即來到你的腦內。

  • One of their leaders was killed in Pakistan recently.

    他們的領導人之一,最近在巴基斯坦被殺害。

  • So these symbols and these leaders

    因此,這些象徵和這些領導人

  • come to your mind immediately.

    立即來到你的腦內。

  • And that's the power of social movements.

    這便是社會運動的力量。

  • They're transnational, and they bond around these ideas and narratives

    它們是跨國的,它們圍繞這些理念,敘事.

  • and these symbols and these leaders.

    這些象徵和這些領導人。

  • However,

    但是,

  • if I ask your minds to focus currently on Pakistan,

    如果我我要你把重點放在目前的巴基斯坦,

  • and I ask you to think

    要你認出

  • of the symbols and the leaders for democracy

    今天在民主巴基斯坦的

  • in Pakistan today,

    象徵和領導人,

  • you'll be hard pressed

    你便會難於啟齒,

  • to think beyond perhaps

    也許僅是想到

  • the assassination of Benazir Bhutto.

    貝娜齊爾•布托遇刺。

  • Which means, by definition,

    這意味著,顧名思義,

  • that particular leader no longer exists.

    即是領導者不再存在。

  • One of the problems we're facing is, in my view,

    在我看來, 我們面臨的問題之一是,

  • that there are no globalized,

    沒有全球化

  • youth-led, grassroots social movements

    青年領導,基層民主文化的社會運動

  • advocating for democratic culture

    倡導跨越穆斯林

  • across Muslim-majority societies.

    佔多數的社會。

  • There is no equivalent of the Al-Qaeda, without the terrorism,

    沒有相當於基地組織水平, 但沒有恐怖主義

  • for democracy across Muslim-majority societies.

    的民主集團跨越整個穆斯林佔多數的社會。

  • There are no ideas and narratives and leaders and symbols

    沒有概念,敘事和領導人

  • advocating the democratic culture on the ground.

    在地面上提倡民主文化。

  • So that begs the next question.

    這便引出下一個問題。

  • Why is it that extremist organizations,

    為什麼極端組織,

  • whether of the far-right or of the Islamist extremism --

    這包括那些無論是極右或伊斯蘭極端主義的 --

  • Islamism meaning those who wish to impose

    伊斯蘭教主義是指那些想

  • one version of Islam over the rest of society --

    施加其餘社會對伊斯蘭教一個版本的人--

  • why is it that they are succeeding

    為什麼他們在一個全球化的

  • in organizing in a globalized way,

    舉辦方式可以成功,

  • whereas those who aspire to democratic culture

    而那些渴望民主文化的

  • are falling behind?

    便落後?

  • And I believe that's for four reasons.

    我認為有四個原因。

  • I believe, number one, it's complacency.

    我相信,第一,便是自滿。

  • Because those who aspire to democratic culture

    因為那些渴望期於民主文化的人

  • are in power,

    都擁有權力,

  • or have societies

    或都駐於

  • that are leading globalized, powerful societies,

    全球化領先的,強大的社會,

  • powerful countries.

    強大的國家的社會。

  • And that level of complacency means

    而該級別的自滿意味著

  • they don't feel the need to advocate for that culture.

    他們不覺得需要倡導這種文化。

  • The second, I believe,

    第二,我相信,

  • is political correctness.

    是政治上的正確性。

  • That we have a hesitation

    我們有一個毫不猶豫地

  • in espousing the universality of democratic culture

    擁護民主文化的普遍性,

  • because we are associating that --

    因為我們是關聯着 --

  • we associate believing in the universality of our values --

    與極端分子 -- 我們贊同相信在我們對價值觀的

  • with extremists.

    普遍性。

  • Yet actually, whenever we talk about human rights,

    然而實際上,當我們談論人權,

  • we do say that human rights are universal.

    我們不會說人權是普遍的。

  • But actually going out to propagate that view

    但實際上是去宣傳這個觀點

  • is associated with either neoconservativism

    是與新保守主義或

  • or with Islamist extremism.

    與伊斯蘭極端主義關聯。

  • To go around saying that I believe

    繞過去說,我相信

  • democratic culture is the best that we've arrived at

    民主文化是最好的,

  • as a form of political organizing

    作為一種政治組織形式,

  • is associated with extremism.

    與極端主義關聯。

  • And the third,

    第三,

  • democratic choice in Muslim-majority societies

    在穆斯林佔多數的的社會中

  • has been relegated to a political choice,

    民主選擇已經退居到一個政治選擇,

  • meaning political parties

    在許多這些社會

  • in many of these societies

    的政黨會要求人們

  • ask people to vote for them

    為他們投票

  • as the democratic party,

    投民主黨,

  • but then the other parties ask them to vote for them

    但其他政黨要求他們為他們投票

  • as the military party --

    投軍隊黨的 --

  • wanting to rule by military dictatorship.

    希望通過軍事獨裁統治。

  • And then you have a third party saying,

    然後有一個第三方的說法,

  • "Vote for us; we'll establish a theocracy."

    「投我們票,我們將建立一個政教合一的黨」。

  • So democracy has become merely one political choice

    因此,民主只成為一個政治選擇,

  • among many other forms

    在這些社會

  • of political choices available in those societies.

    許多其他形式的政治選擇。

  • And what happens as a result of this

    而作為這樣做的結果會發生什麼情況

  • is, when those parties are elected,

    是,當這些黨當選,

  • and inevitably they fail,

    並不可避免地失敗,

  • or inevitably they make political mistakes,

    或者不可避免地犯政治錯誤,

  • democracy takes the blame

    民主主義便成為

  • for their political mistakes.

    犯政治錯誤的靶標。

  • And then people say, "We've tried democracy. It doesn't really work.

    人們會說,「我們已經嘗試民主,但它並沒有真正發揮作用,

  • Let's bring the military back again."

    讓我們帶軍方回來。」

  • And the fourth reason, I believe,

    第四個原因,我相信,

  • is what I've labeled here on the slide as the ideology of resistance.

    是我這裡幻燈片上標有稱為意識形態的阻力。

  • What I mean by that is,

    我是說,

  • if the world superpower today was a communist,

    如果今天的世界超級大國,是一個共產主義,

  • it would be much easier for democracy activists

    民主活動家便會更容易

  • to use democracy activism

    使用民主的激進主義

  • as a form of resistance against colonialism,

    作為反對殖民主義的阻力形式,

  • than it is today with the world superpower being America,

    比它是當今世界的超級大國美國,

  • occupying certain lands

    佔用一定的土地

  • and also espousing democratic ideals.

    但也贊成民主的理想。

  • So roughly these four reasons

    所以這四個方面的原因

  • make it a lot more difficult for democratic culture to spread

    大致做出了不少難度,讓民主文化傳播

  • as a civilizational choice,

    作為一個文明的選擇,

  • not merely as a political choice.

    而不是僅僅作為一種政治選擇。

  • When talking about those reasons,

    談到這些原因時,

  • let's break down certain preconceptions.

    讓我們打破某些先入為主的思路。

  • Is it just about grievances?

    難道僅僅是怨氣嗎?

  • Is it just about a lack of education?

    難道僅僅是缺乏教育嗎?

  • Well statistically,

    統計學指出,

  • the majority of those who join extremist organizations are highly educated.

    那些加入極端組織的大多數都受過高等教育。

  • Statistically, they are educated, on average,

    據統計,他們平均的教育水平

  • above the education levels

    比西方社會

  • of Western society.

    平均教育水平更高。

  • Anecdotally, we can demonstrate

    有趣的是,我們可以證明,

  • that if poverty was the only factor,

    如果貧困是唯一因素,

  • well Bin Laden is from one of the richest families in Saudi Arabia.

    那拉登在沙特阿拉伯是最富有的家庭之一。

  • His deputy, Ayman al-Zawahiri, was a pediatrician --

    他的副手艾曼•扎瓦希里,是一名兒科醫生 --

  • not an ill-educated man.

    不是一個沒受過教育的人。

  • International aid and development has been going on for years,

    國際援助和發展已持續多年,

  • but extremism in those societies, in many of those societies,

    但這些社會中的極端主義,在這些許多社會中,

  • has been on the rise.

    一直在上升。

  • And what I believe is missing

    我相信真正失踪的是

  • is genuine grassroots activism

    激進的

  • on the ground,

    地面基層,

  • in addition to international aid,

    除了國際援助,

  • in addition to education, in addition to health.

    除了教育,除了健康。

  • Not exclusive to these things, but in addition to them,

    這些東西不是排他性的,但除了他們,

  • is propagating a genuine demand for democracy on the ground.

    便是在地面上傳播民主的真正需求。

  • And this is where I believe

    這是我認為

  • neoconservatism had it upside-down.

    新保守主義已經倒了。

  • Neoconservatism had the philosophy

    新保守主義的理念,

  • that you go in with a supply-led approach

    是要你去供應一個為主導的的做法,

  • to impose democratic values from the top down.

    在從最頂部徵收民主價值。

  • Whereas Islamists and far-right organizations, for decades,

    而伊斯蘭主義和極右組織,幾十年來,

  • have been building demand for their ideology on the grassroots.

    已在基層為他們的思想建設需求。

  • They've been building civilizational demand for their values

    他們一直在基層建設他們對價值觀

  • on the grassroots,

    的文明需求,

  • and we've been seeing those societies slowly transition

    我們已經看到這些社會慢慢過渡到

  • to societies that are increasingly asking for

    正越來越多地要求

  • a form of Islamism.

    伊斯蘭教社會的形式。

  • Mass movements in Pakistan

    由阿拉伯起義後,

  • have been represented after the Arab uprisings

    在巴基斯坦已有一些聲稱表示

  • mainly by organizations

    政教合一形式的組織

  • claiming for some form of theocracy,

    群眾運動,

  • rather than for a democratic uprising.

    而不是主要民主起義。

  • Because since pre-partition,

    因為自從分區前,

  • they've been building demand for their ideology on the ground.

    他們已經為他們在地面上的意識形態的需求建設。

  • And what's needed is a genuine transnational

    我們需要的是一個真正的跨國

  • youth-led movement

    青年為主導的運動,

  • that works to actively advocate

    積極倡導

  • for the democratic culture --

    民主文化 --

  • which is necessarily more

    這是必然

  • than just elections.

    不只是選舉。

  • But without freedom of speech, you can't have free and fair elections.

    但是,如果沒有言論自由,你沒有自由和公正的選舉。

  • Without human rights, you don't have the protection granted to you to campaign.

    沒有人權,你沒有向你授予保護的競選活動。

  • Without freedom of belief,

    沒有信仰自由,

  • you don't have the right to join organizations.

    你沒有參加組織的權利。

  • So what's needed is those organizations on the ground

    所以我們需要的是這些地面上的

  • advocating for the democratic culture itself

    組織倡導民主文化的本身

  • to create the demand on the ground for this culture.

    創造這種文化的需求。

  • What that will do

    那會做的是

  • is avoid the problem I was talking about earlier,

    避免我早先提到的問題,

  • where currently we have political parties presenting democracy

    目前我們已經呈現的政治選擇,

  • as merely a political choice in those societies

    只是在這些社會

  • alongside other choices

    旁邊其他的選擇,

  • such as military rule and theocracy.

    如軍事統治和政教合一的社會民主政黨。

  • Whereas if we start building this demand on the ground on a civilizational level,

    而如果我們開始在地面上建立需求,在這一個文明的水平,

  • rather than merely on a political level,

    而不是僅僅在政治層面,

  • a level above politics --

    比政治更高水平 --

  • movements that are not political parties,

    不是政黨的運動,

  • but are rather creating this civilizational demand

    而是創造這種文明的

  • for this democratic culture.

    民主文化需求。

  • What we'll have in the end

    我們在最後,

  • is this ideal that you see on the slide here --

    便會在這裡的幻燈片看到這個理想 --

  • the ideal that people should vote in an existing democracy,

    在現有的民主社會人應該的理想,

  • not for a democracy.

    而不是一個民主國家的投票。

  • But to get to that stage,

    但要到那個階段,

  • where democracy builds the fabric of society

    要在民主基礎的社會結構,

  • and the political choices within that fabric,

    並在該結構內縫着的政治選擇,

  • but are certainly not theocratic and military dictatorship --

    但肯定不是神權政治和軍事獨裁 --

  • i.e. you're voting in a democracy,

    即是你在現有的民主

  • in an existing democracy,

    投票民主,

  • and that democracy is not merely one of the choices at the ballot box.

    而民主不只是在投票箱中的選擇之一。

  • To get to that stage,

    要獲得這個階段,

  • we genuinely need to start building demand

    我們需要真正開始建設在地面上,

  • in those societies on the ground.

    在這些社會的需求上開始。

  • Now to conclude, how does that happen?

    現在結論,請問是怎麼發呢?

  • Well, Egypt is a good starting point.

    那麼,埃及是一個很好的起點。

  • The Arab uprisings have demonstrated that this is already beginning.

    阿拉伯起義已經證明,這是已經開始。

  • But what happened in the Arab uprisings and what happened in Egypt

    但在阿拉伯起義發生的,並在埃及發生的事情

  • was particularly cathartic for me.

    對我來說是特別令我頓悟。

  • What happened there was a political coalition

    在那裡發生了一個政治聯盟

  • gathered together for a political goal,

    聚集在一起因為政治目標,

  • and that was to remove the leader.

    便是消除領導。

  • We need to move one step beyond that now.

    現在我們需要超越這一步。

  • We need to see how we can help those societies

    我們需要看到我們如何能幫助那些社會

  • move from political coalitions,

    擺脫政治聯盟,

  • loosely based political coalitions,

    那些鬆散的政治聯盟,

  • to civilizational coalitions

    到達在地面上工作理想

  • that are working for the ideals and narratives

    和民主文化的

  • of the democratic culture on the ground.

    文明聯盟。

  • Because it's not enough to remove a leader

    因為它不僅是消除一個領導者或

  • or ruler or dictator.

    統治者或獨裁者。

  • That doesn't guarantee that what comes next

    這並不保證,接下來將是一個

  • will be a society built on democratic values.

    建立在民主價值觀的社會。

  • But generally, the trends that start in Egypt

    但一般來說,在埃及開始的趨勢

  • have historically spread across the MENA region,

    在歷史上會蔓延整個中東和北非地區,

  • the Middle East and North Africa region.

    中東和北非地區。

  • So when Arab socialism started in Egypt, it spread across the region.

    因此,在埃及的阿拉伯社會主義開始時,它在該地區蔓延。

  • In the '80s and '90s when Islamism started in the region,

    在80年代和90年代伊斯蘭教在該地區開始,

  • it spread across the MENA region as a whole.

    遍布中東和北非地區整體。

  • And the aspiration that we have at the moment --

    在這一刻我們的願望是--

  • as young Arabs are proving today

    今天作為年輕的阿拉伯人都證明到,

  • and instantly rebranding themselves

    亦更立即為自己名

  • as being prepared to die for more than just terrorism --

    準備以死亡為不僅僅是恐怖主義 --

  • is that there is a chance

    而是,若有一個機會,

  • that democratic culture can start in the region

    民主文化可以在該地區開始

  • and spread across to the rest of the countries that are surrounding that.

    和遍布到周圍其他國家。

  • But that will require

    但這需要

  • helping these societies transition

    幫助這些社會轉型,

  • from having merely political coalitions

    從單純的政治聯盟,

  • to building genuinely grassroots-based social movements

    到真正的基層基礎建設,

  • that advocate for the democratic culture.

    社會運動,倡導民主文化。

  • And we've made a start for that in Pakistan

    我們已經在巴基斯坦取得了為開始,

  • with a movement called Khudi,

    稱為 Khudi的一個運動,

  • where we are working on the ground to encourage the youth

    我們在地面上工作,以鼓勵青年

  • to create genuine buy-in for the democratic culture.

    創造真正的民主文化的影響。

  • And it's with that thought that I'll end.

    而我會便以這念頭結束我的演說。

  • And my time is up, and thank you for your time.

    我的時間到了終止,謝謝你的時間。

  • (Applause)

    (掌聲)

Have you ever wondered

你有沒有想過

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B1 TED 民主 社會 主義 政治 極端

【TED】Maajid Nawaz:打擊極端主義的全球文化(Maajid Nawaz:打擊極端主義的全球文化) (【TED】Maajid Nawaz: A global culture to fight extremism (Maajid Nawaz: A global culture to fight extremism))

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    Max Lin posted on 2021/01/14
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